ep122 – Celene Dupuis Pt 1

Show Notes

1:21 Myth 1 “I’m just a Stylist”

14:33 Myth 2 “Success Requires Owning a Salon”

24:36 Myth 3 “A Busy Book means Success”

28:32 Myth 4 “If I don’t do it, it won’t get done right”

28:49 Myth 5 ” I can’t afford to let go of my top service provider”

Chris Baran 0:00
How great would it be to get up close and personal with the beauty industry heroes we love and admire, and to ask them, How did you learn to do what you do? I’m Chris Baran, a hair stylist and educator for 40 plus years, and I’m inviting all our heroes to chat and share the secrets of their success. To well, my friends, welcome to another episode of head cases, and I wanted to have someone on that could myth bust some of the ones that have been haunting our industry, and I believe I’ve got the perfect person, because today’s guest is an award winning entrepreneur. She’s a leadership coach, and she is a sought after keynote speaker. She’s helped individuals and organizations unlock their full potential, and as the CEO of revamp salon company incorporated. She’s built a thriving high performance business while mentoring leaders, entrepreneurs and teams to create sustainable success. She is the go to speaker for conferences, corporate events and leadership summits. She’s going to be a she’s going to be hitting on the top 10 myths that cripple our beauty industry. So let’s get into this week’s head case. Celine Dupuis. Celine Dupuis, welcome to head cases. It is such a pleasure to have you on here, and I just want to say welcome.

Speaker 1 1:39
Thank you. I’m happy to be here. You know, it’s been,

Chris Baran 1:44
what has it been 100 years since we’ve known one another on here? I I don’t know, my mom always said, she told me a million times to Stop exaggerating. But how many, how many years have we known one another?

Celene Dupuis 1:55
Oh, I think probably like for sure, 20, yeah, over five,

Chris Baran 2:01
yeah, yeah, exactly on your end or your end, not mine, but listen, I And just so everybody watching and listening now, we kind of cheated yesterday, and we had a great conversation yesterday, and just to talk about what we wanted to, what we wanted to chat about with everybody here, and what would so impressed me as, and I have To tell you this, and I’ve talked about it in the intro, is Celine is probably one of the people that I equate to, that I have a kinship with, because I really believe Celine, that you are one of the few People in our industry that evolve with what is necessary in your life. Meaning, you know, and I’ve done the same panel where I was the perm guy, the color guy, the the design guy, and now I’m the Training guy, etc, and I find that’s where you’ve kind of evolved. I love so much how you’ve taken yourself through the whole industry and evolved to becoming one of the best coaches that I think there is out there. So when everybody listening, when we chatted last night, started to chat about and we were having these side conversations about the myths that there are in our industry and and we were just lucky enough to have Celine that says, Listen, I’ve got a whole bunch of myths that I’d love to dispel and and so that’s what we’re going to we’ve got 10 myths. Count them 10, and I hope I got 10 fingers. I didn’t know there was math involved, but we’re going to talk about those. So Celine Now, first off, just about while we head this up, where? Like, where does it come from? Like, why do you think some of these myths that start in there? Where do you think that they all come from?

Celene Dupuis 3:47
Oh, I mean, that’s a really good question, Chris, I feel like part of my story I have I’ve told this story multiple times. It people die when they hear it. But like, growing up, I told my parents I wanted to be a hairdresser, and the first thing that they had said to me was like, Okay, we support that, but we’re worried you won’t make money. And when I was a kid, like many hairdressers, I was like, ADHD all over the place. My family used to joke. They’re like, you’re Celine. Will probably drop out of high school and become a stripper or a hairdresser. And so, I mean, I think if I would have done both, I probably would be a lot richer. However, that’s kind of the negative connotation that’s put on the beauty industry as a whole. And so I think a lot of these myths come from honestly, I think we talked about this yesterday, fear like fear based misinformation about what really is possible, because the average hairdresser makes $27,000 Canadian a year, which is not great. So I think a lot of these myths are just born from from ignorance and from fear based. Thinking around the beauty industry not being a profitable industry.

Chris Baran 5:04
You know, I love what you said there, Celine, and there’s one thing, there’s a myth right there in and of itself, even though it’s written, and I ensure it’s probably the same thing in the Canadian government, and is his down here in the US, they have that figure down. I think it’s 27 five, or 27, seven is what they say the average hairdresser makes, and it and it’s killing our industry, for people to get grants, for people to students to get involved, for people to get loans. But we know that’s from several reasons, and I don’t want to take time away from talking about the myths here, but we know that part of that comes from people not declaring their income. It comes from the fact that that if we’ve got the average income that we have some people working five days a week, some people working one, two or three days a week, and doing minimal work in those time frames, and they’re averaged out that just in those time frames, but they’re not pushed forward into if somebody worked eight hours, eight hours a day, five days a week, and if they did that, there was studies that done that brought it up to actually, to 55,000 something, which made it on par with when people just start out electric, electricians, other trades, etc. I was even talking to my my doctor, and I know that I’m so young, you’re probably thinking you went going to a doctor. Yes, it was for hangnails. However, she said that her son spent the last seven years in school, and his starting salary as a doctor as an intern was $35,000 so I think a lot of the people just they, they think of the far away number, not the close number, when people are sticking out. So I wanted to make sure that that it’s a statistical myth that, as we know, can be jived by any kind of numbers. But let’s Jive back in. I just, I don’t want to miss these. So what do you think that the one I’m going to call them one, we’ve got 10. But what do you think? What’s the one you want to start with?

Celene Dupuis 7:05
Well, I think the biggest one, and it’s, it’s funny, because I’m working on writing a book right now with 10 other mentors involved with the high performance salon Academy. And the whole premise of the book is based around this first myth. And it’s, it’s like the idea that I’m just a hairdresser, and whether you’re a beauty professional, this isn’t just for hairdressers, but like, working in the beauty industry that, like, it’s not a viable career. And again, I I mentioned that in my opening words, that that’s such a huge problem and and, so I don’t know. I think that is the biggest myth, because I would love to know how many other careers you can, like, really set your own hours. Like, if you work in an office, you’re like, nine to five, right? Like, we can, like, I had a baby, was able to come back and work, you know, five to nine when my husband was home from work. Like, there’s not very many careers that offer the flexibility and the ability to earn income. If I want to take a trip to Bali next year, I can just, you know, pick up five, six extra shifts and earn a little extra cash. Like, it’s very, very customizable, and it can be very lucrative. So I think that’s a huge problem, that that that that myth exists.

Chris Baran 8:25
Why do you think that? Because there’s an operative word, and that’s a simple sentence, I’m just a stylist. I’m it’s my era, baby boomer, and so our era was hairdresser. I’m just a hairdresser, hairdresser, stylist, nail tech, masseuse, Esthetician. It runs rampant in the beauty industry and is, what do you think that the just comes from? There’s got to be something that started it. What is it?

Celene Dupuis 8:56
Yeah, I mean, great question. We both, we both know and love Blair singer, mean, he wrote Little Voice mastery and I’m a certified Little Voice mastery coach, and it’s all about mindset, yes, and so, I mean, I’ve coached, I’ve coached so many people through, you know that six inches between our ears, like that little voice that, and a lot of that, I think, comes from just the way we speak to ourselves, like, right down to our self concept on, like, you know, thinking that, you know we’re not enough, or you know I’m just and you tell people, I’m in the beauty industry, they’re like, that’s cute. What does your husband do? Right? And it’s like, actually, I would like to say I out earn. I’ve out earned every relationship I’ve ever been in at so I think that that myth, myth is false. And I actually like to answer I have a house husband, but I think that it’s just coming from mindset and about people thinking that this is like a second class industry.

Chris Baran 9:58
But wouldn’t it? I mean. It’s, it really is, because it’s perpetuated in our industry. I mean, I’m gonna get a little crass here, but it really pisses me off the way that the movie industry, even when I’m watching TV, that, you know, even watching TV and, oh yes, okay, God, I watched some crimes, crime shows, and they the crime shows when they just talk about somebody that will the producer just got on the lines when he went potty mouth. So just the way that we’re perceived in the industry, we’re we’re either perceived as Airheads, flakes, those crazy people that do and wear wild hair, but that’s the part of our industry, like when you’re in the clothing industry, makeup industry, anything to do with beauty fashion, let’s face it, if you look like a boring, drab person, would you want to go to that person as a hairdresser? You wanted them to be stylish right up to trend, whether it’s blondes or or high fashion color. You want to see that in the industry, because that’s what you’re going in there. When I go to buy clothes, they I want to walk into a place that looks and feels like I do, and that’s part of the culture. So I think that if we can help to get I’ve always said, take the just out of, I’m just a stylist, and that is just as you said, it’s mindset. Interesting part it when, you know, we always talk about gifts that people give us, you know, and would you agree that that sometimes the gifts that they give us aren’t good ones? Yeah. Oh, and they talk to us about your Oh, isn’t that cute? That’s a gift that they’ll give us. And if we choose to go, Oh, you don’t perceive me as as as good as you, you can take that on.

Celene Dupuis 11:52
Yeah. Well, and perception is reality. And I think the an eye opener for me to last week, I was in at our local hair school. I try and go in like, couple times a year and teach, and I asked the question, how many of you are people pleasers? Because one of the things I’ve noticed is that a lot of hair stylists, or people in the beauty industry are people that love to make people feel great and and often, I mean, we’re in, we’re in the customer service industry. It’s like, customers always right? So we’re taught to be people pleasers. And actually, I learned from you the acronym nice. It’s like, not interested, to care enough. It’s like, when your mom’s like, Be nice. Be nice. That means don’t tell the truth, just say what we want to hear. And I think that so many hair stylists are people pleasers, and I think that a lot of that behavior, in fact, every single person in that room put up their hand, except for one and and I had a room of 50 plus people, and it’s like a lot of them. They’re creative, they’re artistic. As you said, they’re people who like to stand out, be different, be creative, and express themselves differently. And I think that that’s where that mindset comes from, is that maybe they weren’t. And I think it’s unfair to say all stylists are like that. There’s a lot of stylists that are great with numbers, super book smart, but we also attract a lot of like kids with ADHD or that were different, yeah. And so I think that’s really where it comes from. So it’s not I’m just a hair stylist. It’s I am a stylist,

Chris Baran 13:28
yeah? And I think it’s the you know, is, if we could help people along, and I know you do this when you when you talk about with the coaching methods that you do that, the idea is, is somebody can tell you something, but it’s only damaging if you take it in 100% you know, like if somebody says to, oh, isn’t that cute? Well, you know, you could argue to the, you know, probably a Saskatchewan. I know we come from the same background. Say we can argue that till the cows come home. But the idea is, is, that is, if somebody pays you a negative, then just say, Okay, fine, and just move on. But you don’t have to take it on.

Celene Dupuis 14:09
Yeah? Well, I mean, I’m looking pretty cute all the way to the bank when I cash my paycheck every

Chris Baran 14:13
few weeks. I love it, yeah. So, so, I mean, we know that it’s, it’s the whole point is, I’m just a stylist. So if we can take that out, and get rid of that and, you know, and I think if we could just start a movement in our industry that, you know, you said this, and you coach, and this is, I’d like you to this little off topic from where we are, maybe it’s not, but how would you like if somebody said, and was taking that on, I’m just a stylist. I’m never gonna make money. I’m listening to that little voice in my brain, and that lizard part of me just wants to survive, or wants to be accepted or whatever. How would you talk to somebody if somebody said, Well, I’m just a hairdresser.

Celene Dupuis 14:56
Yeah. I mean, first of all, I think the. Is where, whether you’re a salon owner or whether you’re a stylist, I think it’s understanding there’s I, and I can’t even credit who made who made this teaching or this model, but it’s like, we just call it the Results Model. But whenever you embark in something like if I decided I wanted to lose weight, the result I’m hoping to get is to lose weight, right? Most of us can relate to that, because everyone’s probably tried to watch what they eat at one time or another. And so here’s the deal. I think most of us go right to just a behavior change. So it’s like, if I eat 1200 calories, I’m going to do a calorie deficit. I’m going to eat 1200 calories. And obviously, what would happen if I change? That’s a behavior change. If I shifted that behavior, I would lose weight. But the problem is, as soon as I go back to eating like, you know, I lose my weight, I go back to eating how I eat, I’m going to gain that weight right back. So behavior changes don’t give long, lasting results, but it goes deeper than that. So then most of the time, we get into mindset like, why am I eating? Why am I? Like, am I eating when I’m stressed? Like, why am I why do I have the feelings I have around food? And I think a lot of coaches get you maybe into mindset. A lot of us have heard of like, little voices or the thought process, but rarely do we go deeper, and it actually goes right into our self concept. And so our self concept is what makes us who we are. And there’s three important things in the self concept. It’s your self esteem. So how you feel about yourself. You know, do I love myself? Am I confident? Do I like who I am? My self image? It’s like, how do I want others to see me, right? Or, how do I see myself and your self ideals, and that’s like, who you hang out with, right? So that the people you aspire to be, they say you’re the top five people you hang out with. And if we don’t get into our self concept and really look at like, you know, why do I think I’m just a hair stylist or, you know, what is it in my why do I actually want to even lose weight? Is it because my self esteem, I don’t like the way that I look, I don’t feel good about me, or is it because I care what other people think when they view me? There’s no right or wrong. But when you can get into your self concept and figure out where it’s coming from, then it’s a lot easier to change your belief system, which sets your mind, your mindset that helps you shift up into changing the behaviors to be actual long, lasting change. So I think, like that’s the long answer, but it’s not a short, magic quick fix to change your mindset. You have to dig deep and figure out where in your self concept is that even coming from? Because the big key, and this comes from Mac Newton, actually, is that your results will never exceed your self concept. So it’s like you taught me, whether you think you can or you can’t, you’re right, yeah. And it’s true,

Chris Baran 17:50
yeah. So I mean, first of all, thank you that. And I, and anybody listening out there, if you know, I would just say this, look at if you’re, if you’re, if you want to know how to change, you need to learn some of this. And later on, we’re going to talk about how you can get a hold of Celine, you know, and have her teach more on this. But so with we’ve got, I’m just a stylist. So that’s Myth number one. Check mark busted. It’s not there. There’s no such thing as I’m just a stylist. We have the right and we have the power to earn any kind of money that anybody else has. And I would put, you know, I can show t, you know, I don’t know. T, fours, w4, is whatever they are here in Canada, right? 1090, Nines that were hair stylists are making every bit as money, as much money, as other professions are. Let’s move on. What’s number two?

Celene Dupuis 18:38
Number two, I think this is, this is a huge one. I think you’re only successful if you open your own salon. And here, this is actually, it’s funny because this came up this week on a really popular Instagram account that coaches hair stylists. And here’s the thing, I think that as soon as you get out of hair school, I think there’s a lot of pressure from friends and family that’s like, once you start getting busy and successful, it’s like, why are you working at the salon? They’re just taking, you know, 50% of everything that you make and like, there’s a lot of pressure to actually like that. I can’t be successful unless I open a business. But let’s talk about where that perpetuates. That’s perpetuating the whole I’m just a stylist. Like being a stylist isn’t enough. You’re only creditable if you can say that you’re the owner. And so I think the problem that happens, and the reason why that myth is dangerous is because it’s a completely different skill set right to be owner of a business, versus a stylist, and so I mentioned that most people are in this industry end up being people pleasers, and it’s like, here’s the deal. A lot of us are like, there’s a lot of people that are, like, lost souls, just like trying to, like, build their own confidence and feel good about what they do, and then all of a sudden, you. You now are leading a team of, you know anywhere from five, I know salons that have, you know 50, 100 employees, and now you’re leading all these people. And if you believe you’re just a hairdresser and you’re becoming a salon owner for that reason, then it’s going to be really difficult to help like salon owner you’re dealing with, like coaching and developing personally, all of your team, because if you don’t take care of the person, they will not earn, they will not have successful careers,

Chris Baran 20:30
and they won’t be loyal, and won’t be loyal because they won’t trust it. Yeah, so

Celene Dupuis 20:34
I think that there’s places for everybody, like, I mean, I run a commission a team based salon, but I’ve also worked at booth rental like, I don’t think I’m not scared of of the commission versus rental scenario. I think there’s different places for different people, and I think that it’s important that we put people in the right seats, in the right places. And I have stylists that have said, I never want to open a salon. Celine like, I see what you have to do. Like, I want to do my clients, create amazing hair, take home a great paycheck. Like, I have stylists on my team that are taking home after taxes. Like, over 100k and they’re working 30 hours a week, yeah, and like, they don’t need to have the responsibility of of taking care of 15 other humans and paying the bills, the rent, the insurance, like the budgeting, you know, all of that.

Chris Baran 21:26
You know, I just to that point I remember, I remember one person leaving our salon and left on great terms, etc. And I remember doing a show, and I saw this person was walking towards me. You know how there’s always the the fairway or the the, the, what do you call them, the overhang that’s between buildings. And I remember that person walking towards me, and we, we waved at one another, and she waved a little bit more eagerly than I thought, and I and then when I got close, rather than just passing, she said, Stop. And she came up to me and said, Chris, I want to, I want to, I want to stop and say, I’m sorry. And I went for what she says, because you were telling me what it’s like to have a business and to start own business and everything that worked along with it. And she says, I just thought that was just a bunch of El Toro kaka and I ordered a Bucha says, now that I have staff, and now that I have people that are coming to me on it, and I’ve had to solve all these problems, I just want to say, I’m sorry for any problems that I caused for you and I, and I just said, look at that. That’s nothing. That’s all part of business. That’s part of the people pleasing business, or the people organizing business. And it’s the same thing of what you’re talking about. When people want to own their own business, or they say, I’m a successful hairdresser, I’m gonna, I need to own my own business, or I’m a successful hairdresser, Esthetician or a nail art person, and you’re and now I’m gonna go and become an educator. Completely different skill sets, business skill sets. They’re all different. And so I would if somebody is going to go on to owning, I would suggest, number one, speaking to owners. Number two, taking business classes, unless you’ve got good and so, just so you’re not learning by the seeds of your pants and just making it trying to get by month to month, you’ve got to have good business 100%

Celene Dupuis 23:18
I mean, I joined a business program, a coaching program for for salon owners before I ever opened my doors. And I would do it again and again. And when people struggle in their business, they often cut out their coach because they’re like, well, that’s like, that’s the first thing that you need is, is a business coach. So

Chris Baran 23:37
and the last thing that you should get rid of exactly, I’ve had my coach. I think we have a similar coach, and I’ve had mine now for probably about 13 or 14 years, and I it’s one of those happy checks that I write. So we went through it. We went through I’m just a stylist, and you’re only successful if you open your own business. What’s number three?

Celene Dupuis 23:55
Number three, a busy book, means you’re successful. And I think this one ties together so well with like, the last one as well. But whether you’re a stylist or a salon owner, I mean, we can make ourselves busy with a lot of things, but that doesn’t mean that you’re profitable. Like, if you have a busy if you’re a salon owner, listening to this and you have a busy salon, it’s like, it’s really more about efficiency and productivity. Your salon can look busy, your book can be busy. But that doesn’t mean you’re profitable. And I think the things that I would look at first as a salon owner are like, you know, do you know the profitability of every single service in your book? Have you ran? Have you gone through profitable pricing training? Do you have a profitable back bar method in place? You know, with things like salon scale, where you know, you’re, you’re in the parts and labor like, there’s a lot of things that, like, you know, a salon can look successful. I mean, I think we’ve all seen it like, you know, just because you drive a BMW or you drive a Range Rover doesn’t mean you have money. I mean, we all have. The ability to live on credit. So I think from a salon owner perspective, that’s the first thing. I think from a stylist perspective, your efficiency and productivity is so important, you can be the most booked style. So you can be booked 100% but if you’re not charging properly, you’re not and you’re not maximizing your time like I can, I can see two clients a day in a six hour shift and stretch those colors out take three hours. Or I can, you know, work efficiently, and see six clients in a day and double my income. And so whether you like to double book or not, that’s not what this is about. You get to choose your own adventure. And there’s ways that you can plug and play as a stylist. Like, if you don’t want to double book, you need higher average tickets, you need to be doing more than one service. Like, there’s a lot of things you can do to increase efficiency besides just double booking. So I think that’s really important for salon owners and stylists to really understand.

Chris Baran 25:59
I remember my dad always used to say to me, it was he’d say, it’s not what it’s not what you earn. Because, you know, you would go to somebody and go to your dad, your parents, and say, like, especially your parents, when they said the careers they thought you were going to have. And you can go and look at the money you have now, and you want to kind of brag a little. And I can remember going to my dad and bragging about what I earned that year. And he looked at me, and it was, you know, it was one of the, probably the best lessons, but the biggest put down that I’ve ever had is he said, Chris, he said, it’s not what you earn, it’s what you keep. And I think that’s what you’re you’re hitting it right on the head there when you’re talking about your profitability, you know, at the end game, if everybody, if everybody just thought about, yes, it’s not about my having my shingle above my station, or my shingle that is above the salon door because I own it. But if you it’s what are, what are you earning, and what’s your take home that you’re keeping and earning profit wise for your family? Yeah. I mean, I may not, I’m not speaking probably for everybody in the world. But if your family is just you, or the family is like many, what do you do at the end game? This industry is going to spit us out, or we’re going to spit it out, and what have you got at the end game? And that’s what I always tell people. You might be doing this all right now, and I you know whether ego is a good or a bad word for you, or whether making the amount of money or doing whatever is good or bad, it’s all at the end of the at the end game, what are you keeping and what’s your life going to be like for you and your

Celene Dupuis 27:32
family? Yeah, you could have a $3 million salon, like, again, you’re it’s like a $1 million salon or a $3 million salon. And you could say, like, who’s more successful? Well, the $3 million salon, but a $3 million salon might be just breaking even, and the $1 million salon could be taking home 10% profit, and the $3 million salon, I’m going to tell you, they’re going to have more staff and more problems, I would pick the $1 million salon. So, I mean, it’s, not just about the number that’s, you know, on the books. Yeah, yeah,

Chris Baran 28:05
because it really is. It’s like people can be the one thing I love about it when I am equating this, when you said a busy book means success or successful people equate that book people going in and out. But if you’re not profitable, if it’s not good for you and your family. I’ve never seen anybody go to the go to the grocery store and buy a pound of butter. Was saying success. But if you’ve got the extra money, if you’ve got the extra profit that comes in for you and your family, then that’s that’s the mark. And I think if we taught more kids that when they’re going into the into the into their business, that they’d be better at the end game.

Celene Dupuis 28:45
Yeah, absolutely.

Chris Baran 28:49
I bet we have something in common. I have this love hate relationship. I hate paying for something that I’m not using. I hate working in a small, cramped box, yet I love working in a cool salon that impresses my clients, and I love the culture and synergy of a team while enjoying the freedom of being my own boss. You too. What if all that was available to you at the salon you rent from, meet artist on, go a game changing way to rent salon space with artist on go, you only pay for the time you’re behind the chair. You can choose a salon that fits your vibe, location and amenities. With artist on go, you’re a part of a stylist community, not hustling alone. Plus, you get to enjoy perks like clean towels and back bar supplies. Check out artist on go built for stylists serious about their clients and growing their brand without the hassles of managing a space. Here’s the kicker, you can save more than 50% on your rent to find out more, go to. B, I T, dot L Y, slash, artist on go. CB, that’s B, I T, dot L y slash, artist on go. CB, so number was a, were we okay? We got I’m just a stylist. You’re successful. A busy book means you’re successful. What’s number four?

Celene Dupuis 30:21
Number four, I think this one, like, will hit a lot of salon owners in the heart, but if I don’t do it, it won’t get done right? And here’s the thing, like, a lot, guilty 100% like, if you’re a type A, if you like the way. I mean, sometimes I just think I can do better than other people. And I mean, that’s ego. That’s 100% my ego speaking, right? And again, like you said, if ego is a good word or a bad ego is not everyone has an ego. It’s it’s there. It protects you and but you can choose to like if you’re living in ego, and the decisions you make are out of ego, it’s not a great thing, right, right? And I think as a salon owner, a lot of salon owners, what I see when I’m coaching them is they’re doing like, $15 an hour task, something that you would hire your sales desk to do, right? And when you’re a CEO, like you should be doing doing, like, visionary type tasks, like, like thinking like $500 an hour, like second location. What can we do to make more money? What can we like? It’s like you should be like, visualizing like and making things happen, not, you know, organizing the front desk or whatever it might be, micromanaging everybody. And not only that, you’re stealing. You’re literally putting yourself in competition and stealing opportunities to grow and and raise up your team. And so you’re perpetuating this whole idea that, like nobody can do it right, because you’re not taking the time to train somebody and to give them the grace to also make the mistakes. So those salon owners end up really burnt out, you know, really broken, and they don’t have the ability to have people in the wings waiting to help and step up because, like, of the system they’ve created. So that’s a huge one. I think on the stylist side, I think what often happens is, you know, at the salon, we call this criminal exchange. Like, you know you’re taking care of your clients. You know you obviously have to keep your space tidy. You’re using that space. It’s like if you cooked in my kitchen, I’d expect you to clean it. You’re going to do clients like out of a salon space for a community. We all, we all do our fair share, we sweep, we clean at the end of the night. And sometimes, I think, you know, stylists, they do so much for the salon too, to keep that space looking amazing. And I think sometimes they can also feel like I do so much around here, right, like there’s so much that I’m doing for this space, and like I don’t feel appreciated, and I don’t feel compensated and and so a lot of salon owners will ask, I mean, I meet stylists who are like, I do the social media at my salon. I do this in my salon. I’m doing that, and they’re not being fairly compensated. And so I think that that’s called criminal exchange, and it can happen on both sides. And I think, like, you just got to remember a great speaker. I know we both know him, Jason Everett from the high performance salon Academy. He talked about how we can dehumanize our staff, but then also our staff can dehumanize us as salon owners. Because it’s like, I like, you know, I’m more than just signing the payroll and fixing the leaky sink. And like, you know, I have emotions and feelings, and I go through trauma and pain, just like anybody else, but when you’re in that, that role of being the leader, you sometimes can’t really share that with your team. And then on the other side, we also dehumanize our team sometimes, and we’re like, you know, why didn’t you guys clean up the salon is a mess, and you didn’t get your numbers in, and this is happening and, and so I think it’s just creating a space where we can really make sure that there’s a lot of open communication and that we’re all working together for the common mission.

Chris Baran 34:10
Yeah, you know, you hit some amazing points in there. And I, I think doesn’t, does it all turn still turns back to mindset, doesn’t it? You know, from whatever it is. And I think everything that I’m hearing in here is all based on mindset. And I, I know that I don’t want to go into this too long and too deep, but I, I think that there’s always when somebody is motivated versus not motivated. There’s something in there that sparked it, you know. And so we got to find out what the story is. And often, we can often create our own disabling stories. I, I remember I one of my coaches put me through this test, and because I was always, I was the micromanager. Still am to a little bit, but I’m, you know, my point was, is, Hi, my name is Chris, and I’m a perfectionist. But my point was, is that, is that, what is that story calling? It? Know, why am I? Why do I feel this need that I have to be a perfectionist? And when, when the person put me through this thing and said, What did it cost you? And when I looked at number of hours per day that this cost me, it actually cost me three months out of the year, and my one of the results, that is, the disabling story was, is I wasn’t good timing. I wasn’t getting time with my family. I was working 1011, hour days. I didn’t have any chances for holidays. But if I looked at the and rewrite the story, get somebody to help me with that story, and what’s disabling me, and then when I found out if I can just write a different story and I can live by that story, all of a sudden the other stuff, I get all that other stuff back. So once we came up with and helped me understand that I don’t there is no such thing of perfection. If I can just say, hey, 80% and done is freaking awesome. That if I can do that and just get something to 80% doesn’t have to be perfect, because it’s other half of the time I would go to I wanted perfect and never got done. Yeah? So if we can understand what it costs us with those disabling stories, then that also helps us to get rewriting the story and go, damn, I’m doing so silly. Yeah? Well said. So number five. What’s number five? Oh, this

Celene Dupuis 36:21
is going to be a hot topic one. So number five, this, this, I think it hits salon owners and it hits stylists, but there’s no way to say it in a line that makes sense for both. So stay with me. You can’t afford to let go of your top service provider. So that one is speaking to the salon owner, but the flip side for stylist, it’s like, you know, I can’t afford or it’ll hurt my career if I leave the salon and not happy yet. That’s kind of the two sides of the coin. And I think this is a hot topic, because, like, I will say having to fire someone is literally the least favorite part of my job. And twice in 10 years, I’ve had to specifically myself, had to let go of my highest earner. And that was really tough. And I think tough for a couple reasons. Salon owners listening to this, I know you’re going to be like, I totally get this. It’s like, I mean, I didn’t sleep, I didn’t eat, like, two three days leading up like it was awful. I actually sat in the car for 40 minutes before I went in to just do the deed. And my friend was on the phone, who’s a salon owner, was like, Get your ass out of the car, like you got to do this. And here’s the deal. I knew that person wasn’t happy. They weren’t participating in a great way anymore in our salon, like they weren’t showing up how they should show up anymore, and it was affecting the entire culture of my team. People I had, actually, I’ve had, I had five or six people quit because of this person over a span of a few years, but I hung onto them because they had so much growth, they had so much potential, and they were damn good at what they did, and fear was like the story. And so the reality is, is that if I made that decision out of love, that that would look like I need to protect my team, but also that person deserves to be like, we’re not going to be for everybody. Some people are a season, a reason or a lifetime, and this person was like a large season of my business and zero ill feelings towards them. Now they’re they’re quite successful on their own, but they deserve to go somewhere and be happy. And I knew I grew that person as much as I could, and I had nothing left to give, and it was only going to harm them and my business. But the trade off is, I know that I’m going to become the villain in that person’s story forever. And that sucks, really sucks. And so I think that’s the salon owner side. The stylist side is it’s like you get so used to where you are, whether it’s because it’s usually fear as well. But whether it’s comfort or you’re worried you’ll lose clients, or you just don’t want to go through the hassle of moving. I mean, at the end of the day, I think if you’re not happy with where you are, you’re not growing anymore, and your values don’t align with the place that you’re at, you also deserve to be happy, and you can, you can say goodbye in a way that’s filled with integrity. Doesn’t have to be dramatic. Even if you have a dramatic salon owner or salon owner, if you have a dramatic stylist, you still can choose how you respond and react, and you have to detach yourself from the fear on what they may say to other people. I mean, I had to, I had to fire somebody for theft. And, I mean, they spread all over town that I wrongfully dismissed them, even though I won the suit with the Labor Board. All the thing, who cares? It doesn’t matter. The story doesn’t matter. You know, it’s and I think that that’s such a hard one for both sides.

Chris Baran 39:58
Yeah, you know, um. I’m loving what I just put a few notes down here, because I love what you you were saying. And there’s that oldest expression that sometimes they’re gone, but they haven’t left yet. And I think if you can catch it before, then you know, because either if somebody, if something happens, whether or not the person they were before, if they were good at one time, I’m willing, I’m able, I have the skill and Put me in coach. And you have that kind of you want to keep them, but if they go over to that other side, you’ve got to find out what the conflict was, and if it’s still there and they’re not willing, they’re not able, then it’s about correction. You’ve got to get them. You’ve got to find them a place. I know that you and I talked a little bit about this yesterday, and I was relating the story about a good buddy out of mine, a mine out of Australia. His name is Benny tognini, and he had an amazing person that was working for him, but he could just tell he wasn’t happy. And he had to sit down with him and said, Look at i i can tell that you’re not happy here. So I want you to be happy. So why don’t you let me help you find a place where you can be happy in and he actually went out and recommended, because it was, it wasn’t that he was a bad person, just wasn’t happy there. And he said, let me help you. And he actually helped to find him another job. He was happy there, and there’s still good buds. So you know, I think what you’re saying is so spot on, that it was sometimes just the fear of what we have that keeps us from doing it. And like you said, lost people. And the other side, I think you probably know my former employer, Bill Ross, out of Saskatoon as well. And I’ll remember when I left, because when I was there, I think beer Bill was so afraid I was going to leave that he would offer me 45 then 50, then 50, then 60. I think it was making 65% commission when he left, just to keep me. And when I started the business, he he phoned me up. Said, got time for coffee, which we always did. So it was nothing unusual. So he went out for coffee, and he said, Chris, I just want to thank you. And I got all puffy, and I was going, Oh, very cool. What’s he going to thank me for now? And he said, I want to thank you for leaving. And I said, Okay, he said. I said, why? He said, Because I was paying you 65% commission. I hired two more people that I’m paying 35% commission to, and they’re doing the same volume that I did, and I’m making more money than I did when you were working here.

Celene Dupuis 42:19
It’s not sustainable.

Chris Baran 42:21
Yeah, exactly. That’s that is the point. And I think he figured that out, yeah. I mean, to his point, one of the best people, he said, Here’s your six months of booking. He actually took me down to the bank and helped me get the loan for the business. He set me up with all the right people. So I tell you, he was one of one of my mentors, still is, and I still appreciate him so much. So I just want people to understand that, if you sometimes it’s just good if things aren’t working for you, for them, that it is time just to let them go.

Celene Dupuis 42:53
It is. And I think one thing that we do that’s very different. In my company, I just did a job interview. I hired someone last week, and in the job interview, I let them know what it looks like if they’re uninvited from our company or they choose to leave. And like you don’t usually talk about that at a job interview, but I just believe so much in honest conversations, and it’s like, listen like I hope that this is like a forever fit for you, but the reality is, is that, like, we may be a stepping stone for you or and, you know, this is, this is what you can expect and, and I think I mean, even the person I fired for theft, we still emailed all of their clients, let them know where to book with this person. Because people are people. I don’t own them. The stylist doesn’t own them. And my number one goal is to take care of the culture of my company, which is the other people that work there, and to make sure that the clients are cared for and don’t feel like they’re a kid being pulled back and forth in a divorce. Because I think that looks bad for everybody, yeah,

Chris Baran 43:53
because that ruins the relationship you have with that client 100% and

Celene Dupuis 43:57
I think, I think that what I’ve realized, because we have a red, yellow, green light system. And it’s like, you know, if you’re ever in yellow, like something’s off for you, you’re not sure if you’re happy or you’re upset about something. I want to talk to you in yellow. I don’t want to wait till you’re in red. It’s like being dumped and not having a clue that the person you were with was even unhappy. Like, I hate that. But what I’ve realized is that when people quit and I’m like, Well, why didn’t they come to me? Why still, like, they open their own space and they didn’t feel comfortable, like, Did I do something? What I’ve realized is that crucial conversations are very difficult. All I can do is set up the trust and the framework, and I have some that are like, this is what I want to do, and I have some that, to be quite honest, just aren’t brave enough to have those conversations. And I think that I would encourage you that if every business I left, I left and started my own, and I sat down and I talked to the salon owner, I told them what I was doing, and I had those uncomfortable conversations, because if you can’t have that, you’re not ready to. Own a business like you have to be willing. Brene Brown talks about being ready to rumble, to get in the ring and have those conversations even when they’re uncomfortable. Yeah,

Chris Baran 45:10
yeah, because I was loving what you said about that, if there’s no place to grow. And I remember a line that I heard along the way, that was, if somebody is working for you, if they don’t see that there’s a place they can grow into that they’re going to bolt, yeah, so I think that’s exactly it. And sometimes, let’s face it, as an owner, there is no other they can go so high. And other than starting their own business or doing whatever, there could be points where there’s no place to grow into. And I, I think that’s why profit sharing within your business becoming part of the organization, if that’s your bag and your jam, then that’s that’s ways that you can it’s probably out in the game as well. But I just, I’ve just got to know, I’m going back in my brain here, and I know it’s like when you say, Where the hell did the time go? And I said, we’ve got 10, we’ve got 10 myths that we’ve gone to and we’ve gone through five, and we’re about at sort of where we want to be at the end game in here. So we’re very ambitious people. Well, I guess, yes, it’s always what I do is there’s more on my plates, like our classes, I’m plan more than I can actually do rather than budgeting. So I just have a simple question, would you come back? I’d love to, would you come back and then so we can wrap up those other five it would be, it would be an honor, if you would, because I think there’s been such great conversations.

Celene Dupuis 46:40
Yeah, I’m definitely, I’m green light. Let’s do it. Okay,

Chris Baran 46:44
now, before I go what I want, what I always want people to do is, I know, just from the conversations we have, people are going to want to get a hold of you. They’re going to want to know more information if they want to get a hold of you. What? What are things that you can either a help them with, or how do they get a hold of you.

Celene Dupuis 47:00
Yeah, I love that. So there’s a couple different things I do. First of all, my website has everything you need to know. It’s www, dot Celine dupuy.com, pretty simple. Just my name. You just have to know how to spell it,

Chris Baran 47:14
C, E, L, M, C, E, L, E, N,

Celene Dupuis 47:17
E, D, u, p, U, I, s, but what I what I do is I, like, I said, I’m a certified Little Voice mastery coach. It’s a six week program that, like, it basically helps you become the biggest, most badass version of you. So you, it’s really like, you dive deep into the mindset of, like, what your thought patterns are saying and how they’re holding you back. So, I mean, I’ve had people that that finished that program and like, have have made, well, I know you took it, you have an incredible story from from taking that course. But I have people who, you know, make huge moves in their business. I’ve had people that have been able to strengthen their personal relationships. Like, whatever your goal is we customize it to, like, what do you want to get done in the next six weeks? And then we find out what bullshit stories you’re telling yourself that actually stand in your way of getting there. So that’s the main thing I do. And then I’m a, I’m a mentor with high performance salon Academy. So I mean, I’m a speaker trainer. I do strict training and speaking for events. I certainly can be booked for events. But you know, if you’re a salon owner looking to take your business to the next level, it’s like, let’s connect again. All of that information is on my website and high performance salon Academy, you know, could be a great fit for you.

Chris Baran 48:35
Yeah. And one thing I will tell because I’ve been through that little voice mastery, is that they help you, and I love what you said, they help get over your bullshit, but they’re also it’s because you have in that program, you have an accountability partner that will hold your feet to the fire. And if you say you’re going to do something, then you have to do it, otherwise, you’ve got to come back and admit that you didn’t. And it was one of the best things that I ever did, and it helped me to get where I am today, so I highly endorse that. So Celine, I’m bummed that we didn’t get a chance to get through all of those today, but I think we got through them in depth, and I would sooner do that twice and go through another five with you on another bout. So I just wanted to say from the bottom my heart, thank you so much. Number one for being you. Number two for making the change that you do in our industry.

Celene Dupuis 49:24
Thanks, Chris, you’ve been a huge supporter to me, and it was like a bucket list item to be here. So thank you.

Chris Baran 49:30
That’s awesome. Well, in the meantime, thank you and go out and conquer the world. Thanks. Thanks again for watching this episode, and if you liked what you heard, remember to smash that like or follow button, depending on your preferred platform, and make sure to share it with anyone you know that might be a fellow head case. Head cases is produced by cut action media, with Marjorie Phillips doing the planning parts, Lee Baran on the video bits and. And Adrian Taverner mixing the audio jazz you.