ep14 – Dom Lehane

This week’s guest is Dom Lehane, producer of the very popular hair industry podcast “How to Cut It”. I was excited to sit down and talk to him about his successes and his goals in the industry. Dom’s whole mission is to share insights, inspiration, and information that will take your hairdressing journey to the next level.

• Hear how it all started for Dom with his first big Hairdresser show and how he was blown away by the possibilities available

• Dom always sees himself as a futurist, he wants to do things that are new and different

• He is self taught in the podcast arena, starting way back in 2017 – you can listen to some of the early podcasts here (https://howtocut.it/category/podcasts/)

• Best piece of advice to anyone – Just do it! You don’t get anywhere if you don’t go for it.

Complete Transcript

Chris Baran 0:00
How great would it be to get up close and personal with the beauty industry heroes we love and admire and to ask them how did you learn to do what you do? I’m Chris Baran, a hairstylist and educator for 40 plus years, and I’m inviting all our heroes to chat and share the secrets of their success.

This week, guest and I we share a similar mission and that is to help our industry grow and become successful. And that’s what I love about this gentleman. He’s a fourth generation hairdresser. He is the founder of Hair Club live and how to cut it, which by the way is UK and Ireland’s number one. It’s the original hair industry podcast and that’s been going since 2017. He has been a guest on our Chris camp digital seminars before that’s where I got a chance to meet a person. Just intriguing gentleman, and that is Mr. Dom Lehane. So let’s get into this week’s ad case. Mr. Lehane, you know what the weirdest thing for all the people listening and watching right now? I feel I’ve had so many conversations, I know you like a friend. And yet we’ve never met face to face everything that we’ve done, like Chris camp and all that has always been like this digitally. But quite frankly, that is your domain. That’s where you’re the first one out there that started podcasting for hair. And I want to get into that later. But I, you know, I always think that people always want to know, your background, where you came from and so hairdressing, how did where did that how did that fit into the equation to do want to be a hairdresser? What that’s always the first thing that everybody wants to know.

Dom Lehane 1:47
Yeah, well, firstly, Thank you, Chris, for inviting me on to your podcast. It’s a true honor, honestly, absolute absolute fan of everything that you do. So to be sat here, this side is a true honor. Look, I think people quite often will say to me, that they just think that I sit in this chair behind a mic and we do all that stuff and no connection to hairdressing whatsoever. But yeah, absolutely started out. Well, first up, I’m a fourth generation in our family. So my my dear, great Nan was probably the most successful as of the soul, she you know, back in the 30s 40s had a string of salons in London. My nan, mom, myself came into the industry in 1986. At the age of 16. Again, I was surrounded by the industry because of my mom having a very what I would say Chris, was a very local salon with hood dryers, shampoos and sets

Chris Baran 2:43
to be quite frank wallpaper,

Dom Lehane 2:45
you know it? Absolutely, there was nothing glamorous, no whatsoever what I saw of the hair industry, and if I’m being completely honest, I you know, people sure may have said to yourself, and probably many of our listeners is a common question. Have you always wanted to be a hairdresser? And that question was absolutely no, I had very little interest in the industry. But I think what took my attention was going to here in the UK salon International. And that really just opened my eyes to what the industry could offer. And I think from that moment on, I think I was more suddenly gripped by these platform artists and educators and products which are never ever new, rather than the old lady sat under the hood dries. So that was it. I went into the industry in 1986. I started at Trevor Sorbie. Covent Garden. Yeah, had the pleasure to be. Yeah, absolutely. And again, that was just purely because at that time, Trevor Sorbie was on TV, he was British hairdresser of the year. I thought, Well, hey, you know, let’s write a letter. Because, as we know, that’s what it was. And yeah, I started my career there. I was delighted say that I was a trainee for Eugene Souleiman. Now famous,

Chris Baran 4:04
resting. Absolutely.

Dom Lehane 4:07
And, and to be fair, you know, what a cool guy he was. And yeah, being able to see him in his early days as a hairdresser was truly inspirational. I was blown away by him. But you know, Fast Track sort of a year later, I think London just felt a little bit too big for me. I’ve got to be honest, I think homesickness sort of kicked in came back to my hometown. So basically, I’m based in in rural sort of middle north, middle England, if you want to call it that, and yeah, I kind of went on and learned my craft. I then worked for a series of brands done some field educating open my own salon in 1993. grew that to around about 15 staff. And then I kind of, I think this was around about 2000 and I’m getting my dates right here. This would have been around Back in 2009, I knew I wanted to take a new direction. But along the way, we’d also opened up a men’s grooming salon, if you want to call it that. This was before the popularity of the barber business that we saw late 90s it sadly, that didn’t work out a couple of

Chris Baran 5:17
seconds. Because, you know, those of us that are listening that are the youth that don’t have the gray hair, like, like, like I do,

Dom Lehane 5:25
and like me.

Chris Baran 5:29
You know, that was a really interesting time because for a while, like, for quite a long time back. barbering was huge. And then hairdressing hit and barbering kind of went away and it was, and let me rephrase that for the barbers out there. I respect you. And it’s it’s not that I ever went away but it kind of got a clientele the customers or guests kind of shifted over. A lot of hairdressers, were doing more of the the hair because it wasn’t fades. And it wasn’t clippers. It was all about razors, scissors and cetera. And there was it was that, that that time when all of a sudden hair was getting longer for men, and then about men’s popularity and salons came up, and they started to take away and become a little more masculine. And then all of a sudden barbershops came back huge, and they are huge now, but there was that era in there where it wasn’t really the thing that you might think of opening. So I want to go back to that. That was that was a fairly risky endeavor going into men’s hair and opening routing specifically for men. Now what made that work?

Dom Lehane 6:38
Do you know why it’s a really interesting point and I talk about men’s the rise of the barbering industry or men in general with hair and taking care of their, their looks and their appearances. There was, as you remember, probably Chris like myself, you know, barbering did go very backstreet there was that period, where we had the new romantic sort of era and everything was very sort of the guys were going into unisex salons and you know that it wasn’t deemed to be cool to be going to barber shops. But then we saw in the in the 90s, certainly again here in the UK, and I’m sure in America, too, the lap Max will become a very popular that mid 90s. Then we saw the explosion of people like Leonardo DiCaprio, Brad Pitt, David Beckham, that sort of men went front cover. And suddenly we’re in this period of grooming for men, we saw those magazines FHN, GQ became really popular. And we just saw that interest in in men’s grooming certainly were shaving and you know, there was it wasn’t the beard era this was

Chris Baran 7:44
that was you know, metrosexual and

Dom Lehane 7:47
correct and you know, tats were still probably on the shoulders. And that was as you know, daring as we got with tattoos. But we opened it because we could see that there was a shift that was happening. And, you know, look, we got it wrong. I think the concept was amazing. The space was amazing. We got great interest because it was new. This wasn’t anything that was being done particularly, but we were just too soon to the market. And if I’m honest, you know, we got our numbers wrong. You know you always Clanton probably coming from a successful unisex salon. We knew that side well, but going into the men’s it was it was new for us. And I think we got numbers wrong. We kitted out beautifully. It was well under furniture. It was absolutely beautiful. But it just couldn’t sustain the quieter days that we had. And yeah, you know, so I think probably lessons there were, we always said I think I kind of just wished that we maybe went small rather than going big and glamour and but hey, that’s the lessons that we learn along our journey

Chris Baran 8:57
can go bingo. And I want to circle back to that, because for people that are listening, firstly, thank you for being so candid. Number one. Number two is, is that, you know, the only people that are not the people that are successful have have failed at things many, many times, but they’ve always learned something from it. And that’s what I think is so critical. And what you said Dom was that, you know, here’s what we learned. Here’s the lesson we got out of that. And whether you apply that to doing it again or into a new salon or whatever you’re doing to me that’s critical. It’s not about taking the failures of failures, taking the failure Yeah, good at something I’ll either do that again differently or I won’t do that. But here’s the lessons I’m gonna learn applying it forward. That’s That to me is huge.

Dom Lehane 9:40
No, absolutely. And I don’t think I’m always going to be somebody that wants to try and do stuff differently if I’m being completely honest. Chris, you know, I don’t sit here trying trying to sound like I’m you know, some trend looking guy who’s all over the latest trends, but I consider myself a futurist and by that Is I’m interested about the future. I’m interested about new, I want to do things that are different. And sometimes you could be too soon. And yeah, I’m not a great follower. And I never have been even my football team, you will clearly know that or soccer team, you know, wherever you go. I’m not a follower. I tend to, you know, I want to be a little bit pious,

Chris Baran 10:18
who is who is your team then?

Dom Lehane 10:21
So it’s Westham, which are East London. We now play at the Olympic what was the Olympic Stadium? Premier League? But yeah, we’re batting average. But that’s that’s kind of how we are. So I’m generally not a follower. And and I say that’s probably be my character throughout whatever I do, I would never ever follow anybody. Yeah, that’s for sure. I like to try and do stuff different. Yeah. Sometimes that works. Sometimes it doesn’t.

Chris Baran 10:52
Well, you know, I think that that, you know, there’s always I would say, there’s two kinds of people, that there’s ones that want to do stuff everything differently. And there’s other people that just want to follow a trend. And all it’s all of its good. But the the it’s generally the risk taking that happens in there. And I to me, like there’s this, a banking term that says risk equals yield. And you know, you don’t take any risks, there’s really no yield involved. And if they’re going to do a breakthrough or find something, you got it, you got to take a chance, you know, do it a little bit differently. And one thing that I kind of hope for the youth of today, is that that some some some out there are going to say, Hey, look at here’s something that’s going on, that shifted 100%, what would happen if we did it 180 degrees from that? And I think that’s where that’s where interesting thoughts come from?

Dom Lehane 11:38
Yeah, absolutely. I think it’s actually hosted an event here in the UK. And there was some amazing speakers. And the ones that are were always, it was about being pirate. And I think we’re seeing that now I think is being pirate Don’t be frightened to just do things a little bit dangerous, a little bit more, maybe you know, what not everyone is doing, I think that’s where we’re at, we’re in a very crowded place right now for sure. And you know, you can be very Magnolia and just be safe, paint the walls safe, or you’ve been a little bit more out there and be bold and be dangerous in what you do in a good way. But I think that’s, that’s, we need that rock and roll right now. For me. That’s what excites me.

Chris Baran 12:27
One of my teachers always said that, you know, if anything you do, as you can do anything you want to do, as long as it’s legal, moral and honest in what you do. And, and that’s sometimes what you got to do is say, Look, I’m not hurting anybody when I do this. It’s everything that’s still kosher when I’m doing this, but I’m just gonna really flip this upside down and try something different. And I, to me that they’re in is where creativity lies. So if you can think about stuff like that, that’s where that’s where truly, the next gen of what I call the rising people, the people that are forward thinking are really going to come to those are the people that people are looking at right now. So for all of you people listening, and watching right now, just you know, and if you’re sitting in a safe space, and you’re comfortable, great, but just try a little, something just a little bit different. If anything, for the thing to me, Dom, I call it when I was behind the chair all the time, I knew that I had to do lenghts and layers. It was just a given, that’s where you made your money. But I was called amaizing, I wanted to have at least one or two zings for the day, the one where that client would come in, you’d suggest something you could go, you know, maybe it’s not a you know, you’re not taking somebody from your shoulder length, they’re into a mohawk. But you’re you’re cutting them into something different. And they’re truly astounded, and they love it. And that’s what I call my zing. And I think you have to have those a day and the only do you only we get them as taking a risk.

Dom Lehane 13:50
Yeah, 100%. And I think for any hair professional. That’s that’s big moments, I think to have those zing moments as you nicely call them a great you know, quite often we’ll go through our day and I always call it very menu kind of work as lots of hair professionals. But I think you get that real fulfillment if you have those moments, whether twice in a week or whatever, but you just know that zing you do a haircut and you just think that’s why I came in to do what I’m doing. And and that’s like anything what we do, isn’t it, you know, through creativity and most of us are creative thinking people and we need that to keep it fresh, enjoyable.

Chris Baran 14:29
Okay, so now we kind of went through the hair part. Now I am dead. Just if you didn’t get it in the opening one remind people again, that Dom really was the first hair podcast. And I’m trying to imagine you dom, I’m trying to imagine you sitting around either cutting hair or sitting after, you know, maybe going down to the pub and having a beer and say what can I do that would really shake up the difference? What would I do something that was scary. Hear the hell out of me. And you went, huh? Podcasting? And when it hasn’t been it hadn’t been done. Nobody been doing it. I mean, it had been done in the outside world, within our industry. What was the prompt? And what what was that moment that you said, this is something I’m going to do? And just tell us about that?

Dom Lehane 15:18
Yeah, well, it’s a great question. It’s a question I like to answer. Because did I ever see myself down at doing podcasting? Was? Absolutely no, I mean, I was aware of podcast quite early on in the early days of podcasting, but in truth, I didn’t really start tuning into until about 2014, actually was when I first connected with podcasting, it was an American guys, Pat Flynn, he does a Smart Passive Income. And I was doing a thing here in the UK called Hair Club live. We were doing open chair night, and I wanted an add on that was going to be part of this. And I was listening to podcast and he was regularly talking about it. And I’ve always liked conversation. You know, I think there’s so much to be said, it’s so powerful, certainly in a podcast, because I don’t think you get any closer or more connected to people than actually stuff going straight into these things that we’re all listening on right now. And that deeper connection for me, just blew me away. And, and I remember sitting there and actually, it was with a beer, surprisingly, and we were we were on holiday in the Greek islands. And yeah, there I was, you know, the bit, bought a music and I was listening, and I was listening to podcasts, I was just hooked in all holiday. And that was really the moment I thought, you know, what, I want to do something here. And I looked into it and self taught myself, it was as simple as there was none of this like what we’re recording in right now, Chris, and you know, this was really early stuff, it was a Skype call, I had a really poor mixing board. But I followed the guys and those podcasts are still available that you know, which are launched in 2017. And, and I learned to my way and kind of winged it I listen to some of it as we all do if anything gone by and people say oh you’re you’ll hate what you hear. And actually I don’t particularly hate those i I’m still quite proud of him the sound quality at times is a bit hit and miss but you know what it was just, it was the best best thing I done. And for me, it was all about my passion for the industry and, and how to cut it in the hairdressing industry. You know how to cut it was all about people finding their career pathway. And that still to this day was what it was all about. And I kind of pitched myself as that 17 year old lad in a shoe town here in the UK, thinking I want to be connected to what’s going on out there. And, and that’s what I wanted to bring in the podcast by bringing on interesting, amazing people and hearing their stories. And, and that was kind of where I wanted to go. And there was no goal at the start. It was purely, let’s do this. And let’s see where it goes and consistently weekly. For six years now. We’ve been doing that. And yeah, it’s that was the journey into podcasts.

Chris Baran 18:19
notes here for a second because I’ve got this written down here. Excuse me somewhere in 2021, forgive me if I’ve got this wrong. But in my research in 2021, you had 100 inspirational guests. Yes. How the hell did you do that? And how many do you do? I mean, I can tell everybody from my own. If anybody has ever had to rebook a guest in the salon for hair, and knowing how busy everybody is nowadays, I mean, we even had to read we had some technical issues, so we had to rebook this one. So I’m curious how the hell did you do 100 podcasts? And how many do book a day? And how does that work? What do you

Dom Lehane 19:06
Yeah, well, actually, so probably 21 So we done I think that was 100 episodes. So we’ve now done so today I’ve so I probably like yourself, I record a batch code in a little bit before. I was actually on a doing an interview earlier today. But yeah, I think currently as we speak, what are we February 2023. We are on around about 270 Free episodes plus there’s been other bits in there. So look, how have I done that it’s it’s just easy. It’s committed, you’ve got to be consistent and whether this is you know, you’re standing behind the chair and educator, whatever pathway you got you whatever you want to do. We use social media as well. It’s consistency and and actually doing one podcast episode. That’s only a small bit of that. You know, this is you know, there’s I don’t have this team behind me, this is me sourcing guests sourcing, you know, every element is me along the way. And that’s social media pose. So it’s been commitment. It’s been time. Love it to this day but it isn’t always easy. You know if anybody says or thinks Hey, you sit there and talk behind a microphone and away you go and suddenly all the deals and you begin to become Ultra famous, well, hey, get a life is so nice. But it’s easy, because the people are wonderful. I like conversation. And that’s the hair professional me, Chris, that because you’re talking to people here. I like talking to people just this all day. So yeah, I’m now. I mean, I’ll probably share a little bit further in. But there’s big things happening for how to get it right now as we speak anyway. So yes, I have a small village location salaam, where I literally just work on a very small select clients, which is now just one day away. So yes, I still do hairdressing. And I like doing hairdressing still, because I like that connection it gives me but yeah, we are pretty much now working with brands on projects and everything else that goes with what we’re doing. And let’s say we’ve gotten the next big phase come in, or how to cut it. Yeah,

Chris Baran 21:24
the just with the guests here. And with anybody listening or watching right now, I just want you to write that down “How to Cut It”. And that’s the name of the podcast. So it they are, remember, there was a while back when COVID was hitting us hard and strong, and we weren’t allowed to be around people. And we have a couple members of our family who are very highly susceptible, you know, and they and so we really couldn’t be around other people that are immediate bubble. So we rented a House boat, and we went on out on this hospital journey. And that was the time I just somehow I can’t remember where I got it from. But that was all of a sudden, I know that you were talking to people about COVID and what people they were doing in their salons. That was one of the first first times that I really got turned on to “How to Cut It”. So I want to make sure that everybody that’s out there is really tuning in to that podcast as well. Because just you know, I think there’s enough room for everybody. And there’s always the great information is

Dom Lehane 22:27
great. There’s a lot of great podcasts out there and we’re seeing more and more like yourself come along, Chris and it’s great to have people like you, which reminds me you must be coming onto my podcast I think we were baby to get the setup. So we’re gonna have to reverse that back at some point

Chris Baran 22:42
in the morning to do with it as you’re gonna have to do that. Absolutely it and you know, bags underneath my eyes wouldn’t love to bring you up. I would love but yeah,

Dom Lehane 22:50
there’s there’s space there for everybody at the podcasting is huge for me. And actually, that’s a big part of what we’re doing. So we’re now working on Sophia Hilton’s podcast. So she’s launched a podcast recently. So we’re taking on production elements of that as well. So that’s very much what we’re doing going forward. Because whether it’s me speaking or it’s other people speaking, you know, there’s, I think it’s about, again, trying to put a different spin on different things. Again, that’s probably where I’m at now, but that there’s some great podcasts out there. So none of us should ever be bored or not being inspired by these voices that are coming in. Everybody’s got a different spin on things and a different way of interview. Yeah.

Chris Baran 23:32
And I think it’s just learn from other people’s mistakes learn. I mean, then you can only do that when you get into conversations and find out like, like we talked about on here. So yeah, sure. I just want to jump into as a as a pod as a podcaster. You know, you’re talking to some of the, you know, you have access to some of the most famous English, and I’m saying that was probably the wrong order and most famous hairdressers, that happened to be English, because you’re in their locale, and they know you and you’re the number one on there. You must get some like, and I know you can’t really say here’s my favorite one that I did. But what were some was there were some of the podcasts with some people that really surprised you. Like,

Dom Lehane 24:18
yeah, there was definitely some people that surprised me and that I have to think back and then sometimes you think back you think, Oh, I didn’t mention and that was just a great interview. Yes. We brought in quite a lot of guests from America as well. And I’d truly I’m not just saying this because I’m sat here talking to sort of yourself and probably a North American listeners that are listening in but I’m very firstly, very excited by what I’ve seen in America right now addressing I think it’s an exciting time and certainly I’d love to chat to more than but in terms of sort of being here. British based, actually was an Irish hairdresser who surprised me most and that was Niall Colgan. Oh, Niall, may not be the most famous hairdresser. But certainly during lockdown, he made a big march for himself. But he’s actually now came onto the podcast and like all great Irish people, Chris, they’re great at telling a story. You know, they tell a story like no one else. And now came on, he had been in touch me before. He said, Look, I’d like to come on to the podcast, I’d like to talk about my battles, and, you know, all the various things that he talked about and and a big part of that was his battles, was built in a very big sell on an ego get in the way. But he was battling alcohol, drugs, and a suicide attempt. And, and I actually sat there for, I think it must have been about an hour and 25 hour and a half. I don’t know, but, and it was a least that I’ve ever said or asked in a podcast, because I just sat there and just listen to his story. So I would highly recommend any of your listeners get a chance to check out our podcast with them as well. So that’s nice. So that’s n i a double L. See, Oh, l. G. A. And so if you put in Niall Colgan, I think in the your apps or your apple podcasts, Spotify, I think it’ll, it’ll find that but it’s a great, great listen, and it blew people away. But there’s also I think I’m getting more excited right now. Because I think what we’ve got is this, this new breakthrough generation that are coming through, and I’m really enjoying listening to their take on the industry and how they’re doing things very, very differently. And it’s sometimes, you know, to an older guard can be a little bit frightening. Yeah, we’re hearing that. Some examples? Well, I think sometimes I see a lot on social media from very successful salons and Salon names that have been in the industry for a long time, who I greatly admire. But there tends to be a very quiet a negativity towards a Genner Gen Zed, if you want to call it that. And, and why not? Because it’s like anything, if you feel threatened, sometimes by a new guard that’s coming along and doing things their way, whether we like that or not. They’re doing it their way we did airway on social their way on Tiktok. That’s excited. Yeah. I love that. And in and I was saying this to somebody earlier that, uh, you know, for me, I think we’ve got a generation, maybe we’ve got to be careful that we don’t become those Rolling Stones fans or those fans of 1980s new romantic ska, saying it’s not like how it used to be. Yeah, because there is a danger, our industry is sounding a bit like that now, because it’s shifting. And it’s finding its new direction. And you know, I admire some of the greatest names in our industry, you know, names like Sassoon Sorbie, Robert Lobeta great, but it’s a different time now. And, you know, we can’t lose that heritage, but we have to kind of understand that things are moving on differently. And they are showing us how it’s done. And that and they are actually, in our industry right now marketing our industry in ways that we haven’t been able to market our industry for a long time. Because there is a generation of people outside that are looking in on these reels that are gaining huge traction and views. That may be what TV was doing, when you know, in those 90s We had the rise of the superstar hairdressers, and, you know, times that times are different, but it’s exciting. And yeah, so yeah, I guess what I’m saying is, I get more excited. I think sometimes by finding the more names that aren’t the obvious, again, it goes back to that person, that guy who doesn’t want to do always, you know, what everybody else is doing. So for me, is trying to find guests that are a little bit more off the radar, but they’re excited, we need to look out for that.

Chris Baran 29:06
Do you think that part of that culture that we have now is clients, at least and I’m gonna throw a question at you that do you think that those people that we just talked about that are gaining popularity? It’s because the clients where they used to go for an advert or it was word of mouth or was whatever that would get them into the salon. The what’s attracting them now is the social media and what’s attracting them is they’re researching people by looking at what they’re doing and they’re picking the hairdresser as opposed to word of mouth and so on. What credibility would you is that a credible statements you think are

Dom Lehane 29:50
Yeah, It’s a it’s a very honest statement. Look, social media. Whether we like it or not, has played a huge part in people careers. And when we talk about the booth rental salon, or what we call here to rent chair or to freelancer, the rise of the independent stylist, that has become possible, because social media has allowed that to be possible, you can create your brand, who you want to be in a platform, a platform that is free, easy to set up, and can reach a big, big audience. So therefore, social media has done that really well. It’s changing. And algorithms are changing. So it’s not always going to be easy, they’re eventually going to want more paid models here. And you while I’m on this, while I’m on this, with social media, you’ve got to be careful because you don’t own nothing. Listeners, you do not own zero. And I should know about the effects of what recently, I lost my own personal Instagram account, boom, gone, no warning, no nothing. But other right. And I’ll tell you what happened here. Now I want this to be really important for listeners to because we put everything into that you have a great following on your social media. All it takes is one hacker through a data leak, to get into your, your Facebook. So basically, that’s what happened in the Start a New Year, my Facebook went under, went under attack, literally, I have a two step verification code, I have everything set up correctly. All day long, it was coming under somewhere in Asia, boom, boom, boom, someone was getting it. Eventually they got in to my account. During the early hours, they posted images of terrorists rendus atrocities Facebook closed my Facebook account down, which is obviously met around which is LinkedIn. So I’ve gone a bit off pace, but I think it’s really important for people to know, because we’re so invested in our social media. And anyway, all seem to get recovered. Facebook was okay. I was on Instagram. And then last week, yeah, I went on our had a voice note going on between somebody and then I went back on we’ve closed down your no Instagram account is gone. This disappeared, disappeared. And yeah. It was okay, my personal have how to cut it. And okay, I can rebuild that up. But what I think is, it’s a warning that, you know, look, we rely on social media. And actually there were people within our community who I reached out to, and we spoke to them about this. I know that many hair salons that have had this done themselves. And someone had that her salon business closed down through no fault of her own, and it’s becoming more and more common. So make sure you are really set up right. And be careful. Because I think you know, this social media, putting ourselves out there. I hear work great, great, great. But what’s going to happen? If you lose that, make sure you have data? Yeah, you have a great website, because you won’t notice. Yeah,

Chris Baran 33:03
exactly. Well, that’s that is really, really good advice. So let’s go I want to go back to some of the guests who visited it does that okay? I mean, there’s this, I want to ask you this, because I know what I’m like with this. And then you know, I took this one test that rates you as what kind of a dog you are when it comes to sales. And I’m half Pitbull, and I’m half retriever because I you know when because I want people to like me, but when I want something I’ll grab onto your ankle and I won’t let go. But I know that my retriever side is also got this side where I want to ask somebody something or come on but I’m, I’m you know, I’m so afraid that they’ll say no, that, you know, I just won’t ask it. Does that ever happen to you? Do you get that? Do you just put it out there? How do you how do you deal with that?

Dom Lehane 33:55
So for me asking is Yeah, it’s really strange in how I asked people in it certainly in the early days, it was a lot easier because there wasn’t such a I call it the cabaret circuit or the the chat show circuit. There’s a lot of people doing the chat show circuit now in an interview so in the early days, there weren’t many people getting asked to do a podcast. If truth they probably didn’t know what a podcast was. So So then, you know, I found it very easy. I had a good contact list through already stuff that we were doing here in the UK. So there were some very credible names that that we got are up and running with very early on people like Anthony Mascolo, Trevor Sorbie. Tom Connell, great names that would it and I think that just gave that credibility very early on. I think if I started right now, it’d be a lot more challenging because it’d be kinda like, Well, hey, you know who you are what you’re doing. So it was reaching out with an email or through contacts through a phone call. Yeah. Now Yeah, I mean, it’s I get a lot of people now get in touch, which is hugely complimentary. And it can be, you know, it can be an email, I like to do things in a nice little way I like to do for an email. But hey, Instagram is a great place to do stuff. And I’m very much a voice note kind of guy. You know, I like dropping with a voice note and asked people I find the American guests are more challenging to to bring onto the show, because I think we’re outside of America. And sometimes that can seem a little bit small fry, I think maybe to certainly the superstar of the American.

Chris Baran 35:37
I’m not going to say I disagree. But what I’m going to what I think is, because quite frankly, I’m dealing with a lot of North America, and just fine, everybody here is number one, everybody’s overworked. Number two, everybody’s got their book in there, they’re going crazy what they’re doing their calendar. And then number three is they is everything gets buried in an email. And I found that, like, what we have to do is sometimes we’ll have to, you know, reach out like 10 or 15 times in order to get somebody and actually to to get their email to get them onto a list where we can put them in these are people we don’t have a date yet. I just think that people are so overwhelmed.

Dom Lehane 36:18
And I get that completely. I think that there’s just that part of me. I’m not very good at keep going back and back to people because I don’t want to feel a nuisance. Yeah, actually, that that is my probably my biggest fault. So yeah, I will reach out a couple of times, maybe three times and I Okay, if we’re not getting anywhere. Now on the third. Maybe it’s just not right for them at this. I don’t take it personally because I understand it, you know, we are busy, we can miss things is trying to keep up on a very, very busy time. And for a lot of people as well. I almost think it’s a bit like why would somebody go on a chat show? You know, they want something? I think for a lot of people I think you know, whether it’s selling, selling a course or a book or so I find that that’s a good time to get in touch with people if they’ve got something going on, because they’re going to want to shout out about that. But equally, it brings me back so yes, reaching out as always been singing we do. I mean, I’m, again now I’m kind of planning for July in in terms of guests, and that’s on a weekly show. So yeah, we don’t struggle, it is just trying to make sure that we have a real variation of guests that are going to bring something different to the podcast

Chris Baran 37:33
as a as a podcaster. You know, and listening, helping people with their stories and so on. There’s always this thing because I know that every hairdresser that’s out there right now has some sort of what they call in some form an imposter syndrome, you know, is will they really find out that, that I really don’t know what I’m doing even though they do you know, you can be an expert and still have that do you when you’re interviewing those people? Does that ever come up? Do they? Do they talk about the their feelings of you know, just got my imposter syndrome or whatever has ever come up?

Dom Lehane 38:10
It’s a word I hear regularly. I don’t think there’s very few people that don’t have an impostor syndrome. I mean, not so long back it was just lacking in confidence. But now we’re imposter syndrome is a more sort of way of explaining how we feel. I think not everybody has that. I think it’s the I think if you don’t have if you if you’re so overconfident in everything that you do, then it’s going to start to become arrogant. It’s nice to have an imposter syndrome I think it’s nice for people to be a little bit unsure about yourself. I do a lot of hosting work here in the UK in the UK and every time I get on that stage there’s that part of me Chris that I’m like am I am I am I okay for this? And you have all those sorts of you know why why they booked me for what why? You know what, there’s all these people out there and they’ve bought me two houses so of course impostor syndrome comes in and but that’s nice. It’s a nice seeing shine is is a nice thing. It’s not saying we should be uncomfortable. Yes nice. I don’t want everybody been Hey, you know, I find that almost off putting I quite like that little bit of vulnerability and people that’s a really nice thing. And I some of these coaches not referred in the industry, but there are

Chris Baran 39:30
sorry, I stepped on your credit sorry.

Dom Lehane 39:34
Now what I was just going to say is that we find that there are so there’s so many coaches out there now and podcasters and not in just a hair sphere. This is in all areas and sometimes they’re just too confident they’re too slick, you know, telling us how we should be and no wonder there’s imposter syndrome. telling us this is what we should be doing. Well come on, you know, we you know, it’s a different vibe for A lot of people, but it’s a nice thing to have that little bit of impostor syndrome about yourself.

Chris Baran 40:04
And I think that the more that we can show that vulnerability in it, whether it’s a story we tell and experiences that we’ve had of failure in the past, it’s just the easier it is for everybody else that is just starting to go. Okay, something I gotta go through. And so, once I’ve learned from it, and I come to the other side, I’m good. Yeah. You know,

Dom Lehane 40:26
but here’s the thing, though, isn’t it, Chris, is that we are in a world that a lot of hosts like you, you go into the industry as a hair professional, and you learn your track? Who was gonna prepare us to do podcasts and do Instagram lives and do everything that now is presented with us? No wonder we’ve got an industry of people feeling impostor syndrome, because we’re doing stuff that we’re not maybe necessarily comfortable with. We didn’t get that training in our college days, or our beauty school, we are having to sort of learn as we go in whatever way so it’s a good thing. But I’m not surprised. We’re all gonna like this imposter syndrome.

Chris Baran 41:08
Yeah, no, it’s true. And I remember I was doing a program the other day, and I just talked about, I was telling somebody, they were talking about the reactions, because it was on Train the Trainer, how do you get on stage and etc? He said, Well, what do you what’s it? What’s it like it? Like? Is there a place where you, you just feel fully confident before you step on stage? And I said, Look, I’m always a nervous wreck before I go on stage. I don’t have one or two nervous poops beforehand.

Dom Lehane 41:32
Oh, absolutely. You know, leave me for a quiet five minutes, I get a big event for matrix back last year, and just a big event for Wella. And honestly, people shaking my hand, well, they must have got that guy’s got them as clammy as hands known to anybody because but that’s just because the nerves and the nerves, and you let her know you and Chris, you know, you do, you’re trained to train us Brilliant stuff. I think it’s so so good. But you will both have Yeah, as many times as you do it, you’ll probably have those little apprehensions even when you’re doing any of you, when you’re doing a Facebook Live and Instagram Live, because it’s just doing so we’re not doing all the time. And that’s good. We get that as hair professionals, don’t we? Oh my god, I’ve got that new client and what they’re gonna think of me, they’re gonna always say that new client moment is like a moment that you’re going out on a first date. You know, they want to know everything about you, you know, how long you’ve been doing hairdressing for, you know, it’s all it’s all kind of nerves that sort of run through us, you know, all kinds of ways. Yeah.

Chris Baran 42:40
The the, I want to swing this back a little bit, too, because we’re talking about how to cut it. But you’ve you’ve had, you’ve got other endeavors that you’ve got going on, like I was listening to you that no, you’re, you’re you’re starting the production company, and but you also have the, your program, just look at whatever was on the note that I put on this year. I know with your, your hair club live. Your Hair Club lives still going and what was the premise of it?

Dom Lehane 43:13
Yeah, it’s a good question. And thank you for asking that. Because this is a good one. So head club live is st that we created. 2000 After getting the years around about 2007 Seven, basically idea of Hair Club live, the initial thing was where I wanted to, I was doing some club promoting, you know, for me, I was doing some house music nights. And I kinda looked at this and I was thinking, you know, I like bringing people to an event. Yeah, that’s just the kind of guy I am. And I kind of thought, you know, what, what is stopping me from actually just putting on my own hair events, hence, Hair Club, live live. I wanted that club mentality hairdressers in a live format. And, and we launched that in in my hometown at the time. Lee Stafford. This was 2008 Yeah, 2008 We packed our theater. I mean, it was a sellout. It was amazing. Good. We then promoted more hair events within the region. And then eventually, I wanted to build a community again, this was before communities won’t be coming communities and we built it on st called Ning a platform called Ning and this was before and mighty networks, which I believe hairbrained is now built on so we were doing sync on Ning and and the idea was I wanted this community and again this before Facebook groups, and that’s what it was to bring people together. And then that launched us doing live events and we got inspiration from open chair from America I’d seen I think it was Scissor Candy that we’re doing open chair and we brought open chair night to the UK we launched it and it was honestly a game changer. Absolutely brilliant. We kind of winged it. So the idea was getting a pub 10 minutes on stage, I’d say traffic lights, but we didn’t even have traffic lights at the start. And I kind of found myself hosting this and and I was like the oldest emcee you can, I was bringing commentary to live performance in hair and your standard by the stage and it all got really tribal people pumped up yo It was amazing. And we took it on tour a few times and in the end probably just before the pandemic I was ready to move in new areas and new directions and I felt that probably helped cut it and her club life didn’t quite align for me and maybe the vision so we came away from her club live but it’s still there is still run by Nikki Pope Vincent who run tribute magazine and color world here in the UK. So Nikki still runs out so I was in business with them but yeah, look, we just decided time to move in new directions and I think that’s probably I have so much bubbling in my head Chris that I need sometimes to just set free and do it again. And I like that creative it comes back to Hair Club live still there is still a great platform. Yeah, but we are going on our new direction now.

Chris Baran 46:21
You know you just said that you know this I’m not sure if other people have that like you and I’m always got something going on in my brain where what about this what about this is sometimes that the compliment or I don’t even finish what I just started where I’ve got a new that new idea going on. But what’s it like how does that all of this in the time etc. Do you still have the what do you do for downtime? What do you do for you know, getting your charge back? I was caught I always call it Yes. Your lifeforce particles recharging.

Dom Lehane 46:48
Yeah, you know what I’d like to say I do think amazingly exotic or outrageous or high octane stuff. I’d be lying. I don’t. For me, it’s, it sounds very cliche, but I love just I love outside. I love walking. I’m a creative, I can’t stop thinking. That is it drives me insane. I want to because it tires my head down. I’m always always thinking, but it’s what Tom Connor once said to me, he’s now a creative director with Davines. And Tom Connell said to me, he says you’ve got to be obsessed. And I don’t think there’s I, I would guarantee you’re obsessed about what you do. Chris and anybody else probably listeners that are listening to this are obsessed with the hair industry. That’s why they listen. So I’m obsessed. And even when I go for downtime walks, I’m thinking about stuff. So I find it very, very hard. I’d like to say I exercise. Sadly, I’ve been in retirement in that for far too long. But hopefully again, there’s there’s there’s an opportunity. There are some pegs somewhere under these moves. All right. I know it. I know. There are so so I’m hoping one day we may get it. But you know what? 5050 free components 50 free. I feel like I’m only just starting and yeah, this isn’t about me. This has never been about me. Truthfully, I’ve always said I’m the ringmaster, right? That’s all. I’m not the person who does the the trapeze and now I’m the ringmaster. And that’s kind of how I am so when I’m not being the ringmaster I’m with my family. I like simple time. I like hanging out with my friends. I love football. I was a coach of a football team. youth football team. But that’s now come to an end. So yeah, I’m just sort of finding my way again a little bit in what my son’s now coming up to 18 So his life is in a different place. So you know there’s I’m I’m genuinely as probably as excited as I have ever been. Right now to have

Chris Baran 48:49
him. That is awesome. Again, I just got some some rapid fire stuff that I want to throw at you. Yep, the

Dom Lehane 49:01
bit of first time I’ve been rapid for a while by the way. See if these would make

Chris Baran 49:04
these rapid if I wouldn’t, I wouldn’t have my two cents to add into every one of them. But here we go. This is in general in my what was the most difficult time in your life?

Dom Lehane 49:18
Oh, gosh, yeah, at the time at the late 90s early noughties without a shadow of a doubt. Yeah. There was lots going on. You know, we talked about mental health as well. Yeah, I was you know, again before mental health was overly talked about. Because it wasn’t talked about we didn’t talk about it. And that was truly difficult now

Chris Baran 49:41
an adventure is show that you loved you know the one the one that you say again so with podcast a thing. The one that you went I always call him the one that of wow, I never planned for this but if I had to quit after this one, this would have been at

Dom Lehane 50:03
Oh my goodness. Again I’m gonna go back to Niall I think that was because it was a blockbuster right there just a story that I think you could turn it into a film so that one there

Chris Baran 50:13
are some things you hate the most

Dom Lehane 50:20
bad manners Oh, selfishness those without a shadow of a doubt really greatly bad service you know? I like a thank you or like a please. They’re just simple things that really? Yeah and egos Yeah.

Chris Baran 50:37
Things you love the most

Dom Lehane 50:41
beautiful people are like beautiful people that are honest, regular being ourselves. Great company can laugh at ourselves, you know just positivity that great. They’re positive there’s an energy there’s and kind I mean, that’s not a hard thing is it is I’m not saying we’re always got the same above my head. You know, it’s but look, just be Yeah, those people I love hanging around. And when you have belly low,

Chris Baran 51:10
those are the best, especially when you can’t stop being and it gets to be almost like a church laugh

Dom Lehane 51:16
or low belly laughter Sure.

Chris Baran 51:19
What turns you on in the Creative Process.

Dom Lehane 51:25
New new ideas new, find insane that maybe is happening somewhere else. And it is just new. No one else is doing it that really excites me.

Chris Baran 51:39
And what stifles it for you

Dom Lehane 51:45
find another source doing it already. And that’s so was it for me. That’d be Oh, yeah, certainly. It’s yeah, that that actually was stifle it in a you know, look, yeah, that’d be it.

Chris Baran 52:01
It’s the I just realized from the words I’ve got written down is about the word isn’t here. The things you hate the most about our industry, but it might mean maybe hates too strong a word. But what what are things that turns you off? dislike about our industry in particular?

Dom Lehane 52:21
Back to ego.

I think it’s sometimes your lack of originality, but people feeling that they’re rich. I think maybe there’s quite a lot social, we’re doing things differently. But I think we’ve got to be very careful what we’re doing. And I find I’m getting very irritated by the lack of originality from people. I’m looking for real originality, and I don’t always want comedians, anymore. I’ve got to be honest, that there’s lots of comedians out there to do really well. I’m not so sure we as hair professionals, and I think maybe mocking clients is becoming a bit too much for me as well. You know, I’m seeing too much of this. For the sake of a view and entertainment that there seems to be coming a trend which is becoming more and more popular book dealing. I don’t believe it puts our industry in the right place where it should be. We should not take it too. You know, don’t take ourselves too seriously. But let’s not make ourselves look how we don’t want to be presented.

Chris Baran 53:32
Yeah. What do you say about others is how it reflects on you. Love that? It sorry.

Dom Lehane 53:43
Does that sound Yeah, you’re absolutely right. I think you’re you’re the right that Chris

Chris Baran 53:47
person that that you really admire somebody that and it can be it doesn’t have to be in the industry could be in your life in general could be an honor normally outside

Dom Lehane 53:57
the oh, I’ll tell you who I really am not yet. And again, I don’t think you may be American audience. But it’s a guy here in the UK called Jools Holland. Do you know Jools Holland, refresh Jools Holland. Yeah, he does Jools Holland is an incredible musician. You know, he must be in his. I’d say he’s in his 60s. Jools cool as he’s cool, because he’s just cool. He’s not trying to be cool, but he’s just cool. But he’s cool. I love what he does with music. I think he he does everything that I want to do for hairdressing if that makes sense that he’s, he can put on a stage the what’s the blues singer? What’s his name with a beard? It’s got a beard like you Chris Steve.

Chris Baran 54:48
Stevie Ray by the way No. Blue singer

Dom Lehane 54:51
will be will be guessing I can’t remember is one of your listeners may correct, but he’ll put a blue singer on with the most cutting edge Rock Band, uh, probably just breaking through, and then you got a, you know, hip hop going on. He just has a way of bringing everything together in a really cool platform. And I really admire what he does, and how he does it in live formats and. And it’s just because the guy has a love for what he does. You know, for me, I have a love for the platform. And that’s why I admire him.

Chris Baran 55:26
And when I love that you think that is what we’re took my brain was, how do you reflect that back and all like it? Like, there’s something that did, but how can I reflect that and put that back on me? What do I need to do to change to figure out what could I do to mash things up a bit. I love that.

Dom Lehane 55:45
I love that mash, mash things up. I’m all about mashing stuff up. I love a mashup.

Chris Baran 55:50
person that you would love mashed potatoes or that you wish you could meet or interview that you haven’t so far. Besides me.

Dom Lehane 56:01
Now, yeah, absolutely. I do really want to interview you as well, because it’s

Chris Baran 56:07
there. I know, somebody that

Dom Lehane 56:09
you Marjorie, if she’s listening, she could get that set up for us. That’d be cool. Who would I like? I’d love to step a little bit outside of the industry. And yeah, there’s, there’s part of me that’s itching a bit on that side? Because, you know, I mean, look, oh, gosh, I’m just trying to think the guy’s name has gotten a number one podcast here in the UK. SEO, SEO, Director Seo, but I can’t remember his name. But I think probably just what I would say is there wouldn’t be any, I don’t get particularly starstruck. I can’t say anybody would ever make me think oh, my gosh, this guy, you know, this, this lady or this person is is incredible. No, I just would like, I like the stories. And I think if there’s a story, everybody has a story, every one of your listeners has a story. And sometimes actually, sorry, Chris, I’m waffling a bit here. But for me actually somebody that there’s part of me where I’d like to interview people into their latter years that may be coming towards the end of their life. Sounds really depressing. But to actually capture people’s words to leave for their family for tomorrow that I’d really like to do. Because I think there’s so often there seems like you think I wish asked that person that question, and somebody in your family and we never do all these things around. So I’d love to do that. I’d love to interview people that, you know, maybe you have seen to share before they’ve gone. So doesn’t mean to sound depressing, but more in a positive light.

Chris Baran 57:49
It seems I know a lot of people who are going to that site where they want to help people from that era, and I think that’s endearing. Because I know in other cultures, the elderly, particularly when you’re getting on in your years, it’s they’re there to be ticked taken care of looking after, also for their wisdom. And I find I don’t know what it’s like in the UK. But I think that in America, as soon as you get older, you’re you’re deemed as worthless, you know? And

Dom Lehane 58:16
yeah, that’s, there’s a whole big topic in that as well on age. I’ve got big views. And actually, I’m just going to answer that as well, because it made me think I want to interview my mum. Before that’s too like because I’m coming at 300 She’s a hairdresser. I’d like to get her story, not just for share that with listeners, but I’d like to get that. So that’s that probably my mom. Yeah, who’s

Chris Baran 58:36
gonna challenge you, I want you to get that when you get

Dom Lehane 58:40
to do among that. When

Chris Baran 58:40
are you going to do it?

Dom Lehane 58:43
Well, you know, you always say never to but I mean, I’ve got a free 100 episode coming up. You know, I’m already starting to think towards my 300th episode. What that could be. So could be that.

Chris Baran 58:54
Okay, good. All right. So like that. I just gave you a month off. Where would you go? What would you do? I can’t do anything with hair. I can’t do anything.

Dom Lehane 59:05
Do you know what I’d love to do is to Yeah, that’s easy for me. I want to travel through America. I’ve got to be honest, I want I want to get in I want to travel through America. Number five. I want to get down to that deep South. I want to get down to I want to see a little bit of real America, for sure. And also to North America, Canada as well. So I’d like to work and actually I’d like to go and watch the World Cup in America in four years time and travel through that the bucket list on both levels.

Chris Baran 59:34
Well, you have an open invite to stay here in Phoenix with us

Dom Lehane 59:38
of it. We’ll have a great hour a good time hanging

Chris Baran 59:42
Several beers and bottles of wine, there’ll be quaffed. things you’re terrified of.

Dom Lehane 59:50
Things I’m terrified of Oh my goodness. Things I’m terrified of. I’m not a high octane person. So anything that is dangerous That terrifies me. I like being safe. I’ve got to be honest you’re not going to find me climbing some high tech guy an amazing adventure and he recently at this weather event and he was talking about these ledges that he was done and putting on shoes that were frozen and his feet were frozen I’m thinking Why you doing that sort of stuff man. At the you know he was living for you know his edge. I’m just again, I don’t want any of that. But I by you, so anything that’s got danger written all over it. That terrifies me.

Chris Baran 1:00:35
Me too. i Okay. Favorite curse word?

Dom Lehane 1:00:42
Favorite curse word. curse word in what swearing curse word is? swear word. Oh my goodness. Well, I’m certainly wouldn’t say Well, I wouldn’t want to shock the listeners because I never swear. But you you know what a load of bollocks.

Chris Baran 1:01:10
You could believe that went out. Yeah. Your favorite comfort food.

Dom Lehane 1:01:15
love comfort food. A I’m all over a half pounder. That’s always good. Yeah, packed packed full cheese the whole lot and bingo.

Chris Baran 1:01:28
Okay, something in the industry you haven’t done but want to

Dom Lehane 1:01:36
start touring my podcast line.

Chris Baran 1:01:40
Wow. A do over a do over what something you did in the past that you have you had you could do it over

Dom Lehane 1:01:51
again. Or if I say that and they’re listening in. I’d like to put my own new spin on open chair and I

Chris Baran 1:01:59
Oh, interesting.

Dom Lehane 1:02:04
I’m revealing No.

Chris Baran 1:02:08
Okay, tomorrow, you can’t do here. You can’t do a podcast. What would you do?

Dom Lehane 1:02:18
CAn’t do podcast, can’t do hair. What would I do? I would depends what I can financially. To be quite honest, no matter what I’d be thinking. I would be thinking on my not in my next project. Chris, I’m going to be thinking on my next project. If I’m on my deathbed, I’ll be thinking about right what am I going to take to the gates?

Chris Baran 1:02:38
Love it? Love it. Okay, thank you for those rapid fire ones. I I always like to wrap them up with a with a couple of questions that I always like to ask people is two things. Number one is, is there’s generally somebody in our life that said something did something. And it changed us and was influenced us in a way was there one of those people? Who was it? And what did they say? Or do?

Dom Lehane 1:03:06
Oh my goodness, there’s no prep time. Now why am I thinking here? Who am I thinking is there anybody, there’s loads of them. There’s loads of people that do stuff that there’s lots of people that inspire me, and I think what they’re sharing with I wish I got that at different part of my life, because I think it would have taken me on a not a different path because I love the pathway that I’m on but I think I’d be a whole lot richer. If I if I had listened and taken those nuggets of wisdom and be excited by it. That’s all it is. But not everybody has seen that will inspire me can I think of them off the top of my head? No, but there is even every guest that I talked to really inspired it. You know what you’re doing Chris and you and Chris Moody. What you guys do when you’re training is great. They’re the everything. There’s lots,

Chris Baran 1:04:00
thank you. Okay, last thing I actually have to add two things. Number one, if you had a wish for our industry, you could snap your fingers and and it would change in our industry immediately. What would it be

Dom Lehane 1:04:20
to keep people in it mall? I think I think to keep people in the industry would be a good thing. I think that would help that there’s lots I could go I could talk about I think we need more pathways as well. Yeah, love that. I feel that there is a very limited pathway for our industry if you don’t want to be you know people say oh you could be especially stylists, but they’re very limited. And sometimes you we need to make our industry bigger in terms of what we can go off into so all this digital space is great because That’s more pathways love it.

Chris Baran 1:05:01
And then if there’s one thing that people watching and you could just say that they should stop doing it or they need to let go of something, what would that be?

Dom Lehane 1:05:15
Your desire to want to be a short form video superstar. Don’t get caught up in it. Don’t Don’t let it rule your life because honestly, it means very little, for most. Just concentrate on being really good behind the chair

Chris Baran 1:05:33
in good person. Damn, this has been an absolute pleasure. And I am so looking forward to the time when you travel the US and make your pitstop for a couple of days in Phoenix and I promise you, we’ll show you around and you have good food, no danger, and lots of libation.,

Dom Lehane 1:05:56
it was a beautiful way to finish.

Chris Baran 1:05:58
Thank you so much. It was a pleasure and an honor. And I just want to say thank you so much.

Dom Lehane 1:06:06
Thank you Chris has been really enjoyable. Great. Great hanging out with you.