ep58 – Patrick Butler

https://youtu.be/GrRIk3vESqY

My guest this week was only a student when he became a NAHA finalist. He spent 10 years as an educator internationally and established technical academies across the globe. Today, he oversees the education team at Floyd’s 99 Barbershops and this year he publishes his first book in collaboration with his sister Melissa. I’ve known him for years and I am so excited to share him with you on Headcases. Here is Patrick Butler.

• While at NAHA, he introduced himself to Irvine Rusk and, as a student, asked for career advice. Irvine told him to do good work over and over again until you master it. Fail, start over, and keep doing it.
• While with American Crew, Patrick worked on stage around the world and taught at several AC academies. The experienced built his confidence and developed his skill set beyond his expectations.
• If you can master the cause and effect – the why – in the foundational skills – you will be able to adapt to any challenge or trend that comes your way.
• What does Patrick mean when he says “100% is easy, 90% is hard”?

Complete Transcript

Chris Baran 0:00
How great would it be to get up close and personal with the beauty industry heroes? We love and admire and to ask them how did you learn to do what you do? I’m Chris Baran, a hairstylist and educator for 40 plus years. And I’m inviting all our heroes to chat and share the secrets of their success.

Well, I know you’re really going to enjoy this week’s guest on head cases. And just to give you a little bit about him, he has had 30 years of hair industry experience. I love this fact about him. He had entered NAHA as a student and ended up as a finalist. And that’s what really powered him into his passionate pursuit into education. He spent 10 years as an international educator where he established technical academies across North America, Europe, and Asia. He’s taught men’s grooming. He has been involved in products product development, sales and distribution. Today, he actually oversees the Floyd’s 99 Education Team, and 2024. He will be publishing his first book, “The In Between” co authored with his hairdressing sister Melissa, He is the senior director of creative and technical education for Florida for Floyd’s 99 Barber Shop. So let’s get into this week’s head case. Mr. Patrick Butler. Patrick, it is a pleasure to have you on here. And for those of you listening and watching right now. I’ve known him for years. But I finally met him we did a we did a beauty cast was beauty cast, wasn’t it, the program we did together and, and I just became so enamored with you straight away that I said, this guy has such a great voice and such great insight that I have to get them on our show. So welcome, and welcome to head cases.

Patrick Butler 1:55
Thanks so much, Chris. It’s it’s a distinct pleasure to to join your podcast, I love your podcast, I love the interviews that you’ve had. And for me, personally, I’ve been able to meet you. But prior to that, I’ve been able to watch you and watch how you’ve inspired so many. And it’s just, this is a really full circle moment for me just to have this opportunity to talk to you. So thank you,

Chris Baran 2:18
Alice. Thank you that was very kind and very pleasurable. And part of the reason why I do this program just so people talk nice to me. So listen, you know, I you know, like we know of one another, we’ve done all of that. But what I always like to do is give everybody just a little bit of background on where you came from why hair, you know, and because that’s a question that even people that our industry, always look at our industry and they go well, we’ll get into it later about the the perception that we have of it, but the reality is of a What got you into hair?

Patrick Butler 2:50
Yeah, no, it’s a great question. And it’s one that I’m hit with a lot. And I love sharing it, Chris, simply because I backed into hair. And what I mean by that is that I after high school, all my friends were pursuing education through college or trade schools. And I honestly didn’t know what I was going to do. And I also knew that I had to pay for it myself. So I thought, well, I’ve gotta figure something out. Well, I just started working straight away. And I quickly realized that I needed to do something so that I could earn a better living and make a better life for myself. I just didn’t know what it was. Well, the good news was, I have a very good friend, and she’s a fantastic hairdresser. And she finally sat me down after a couple years, and she said, look, what are you going to do? And I said, Well, I guess I’m an enrolled in college. That’s what everybody does. And she was well, yeah, but what are you going to do? And I said, Oh, no. She goes, so you’re going to spend money, and you’re going to pursue college because you think that’s the path that you should take, because everybody else did it. I said, Yeah, I guess that doesn’t sound so great. Right? And she said, Well, let me ask you a question. You like being creative? Correct? I said, Yeah. Because you like working with people? Yeah. Because you like to be your own boss and guide your own path. And I said, Yeah, she goes, I think you should follow me. And I said, What do you mean, she goes, come with me. And we literally drove to a cosmetology school, one of the better schools in my city. And Chris, I wish to this day, I knew what they had done, because they had done something to me, because by the end of the tour, the end of the conversation, all I recall, was sitting down and signing paperwork. And the next thing you know, I’m enrolled. And it brings me to this point where I’m sitting in what you would consider a freshman class, and I look around. And here’s the deal, I looked around and there was I was outnumbered. There’s a roomful of young women and myself, and that’s fine. But as the instructor started, ask each of us how we got here, why we decided to pursue this career. All these young women had these wonderful stories such as, oh, I used to do my sister’s hair and all my friends hair and I used to play with my dolls and do their hair and this has been a dream of mine my entire life. If it gets to me, and suddenly I go, Oh, well, my my friend said it was a good idea. I mean, just the worst answer possible. And I just remember the side eye that all these these fellow students gave me. And I just shrunk in my seat at that moment. But here’s how it turned around. As we began that coursework, one of the instructors came to me and we’re learning how to use tools. And I was fumbling, I didn’t have that fingerwork that dexterity down? And I started to get down on myself. And she said, What’s the matter? And I said, I don’t know how to do this, and everybody else does. And she looked at me square in the eye. And she said, who said they’re doing it, right? And I said, Oh, okay. And she said, listen, just because they’ve been doing a long time in your mind doesn’t mean that they learned correctly, or they they’ve got the skill to do this the right way. You’re great because I can teach you something fresh, and you’ve got a fresh perspective to absorb that. And to do it correctly and build a skill set where I don’t have to break down bad habits. And I’ll tell you, Chris was some of the best information I could have had at that moment, because it just boosted me up and gave me confidence that I didn’t have. And suddenly I said, You know what? I’m going to take everything on now. I’m going to dive in deep. And so that’s, that’s really how it began, it began in really backhanded way. Or someone really prompted and guided me. And thank goodness they did, because it gave me the opportunity to learn something new. And suddenly it was like that, that moment you see in movies where it’s the epiphany moment, right? Where someone the light shines, and music plays and someone goes, Ah, there it is. And Chris, in that moment, I had that epiphany that this is where I was supposed to be, this is what I was supposed to do. Now it’s upon me to take on everything and learn as much as I could. And that’s how it started. Yeah,

Chris Baran 6:50
well, first of all, I take my hat off to the admissions person that was guiding you through that tour, number one, and secondly to that teacher. And because I think that’s something that gets short circuit along the way that we didn’t have in songs about beauty school dropout, and all those things that affect our industry. But it just wanted to pay some homage to that. That instructor because she could have just turned that whole thing around said, Yeah, whatever, and left you hanging there, and it might have what your career may have went in a different in a different direction. But that one guided moment that that that clear, specific instruction that you gave to have the why that that shifted and changed you so I, you know, I always take my hat off to those people, because those are the ones that train all of the new people are coming into our industry. And they get I think they get sometimes the short end of the stick. But also, I just wanted to ask you this, because I find that oftentimes, because I believe in always paying homage to the people that you know, the people that helped you, and the people you learn from like I always say that anything that I’ve learned from somebody else, I always give them credit. And rather than saying that I came up with it. Who was the person that that your friend who you know, unless you don’t want to say so. But is that friend just to give them a shout out?

Patrick Butler 8:14
No, her name is Shelly Shelly McPherson and she just a wonderful friend and someone that I admire so much for the work that she has done behind the chair. I mean, just, you know, Chris, there’s an era that and I don’t want to date myself and sound like this, that golden era is gone necessarily. But there was an era where you looked at people behind the chair, hairdressers, hairstylists and barbers. And the craft that they honed in on and focused on was that at such an elevated level, and, and we continue to aspire to get there, don’t get me wrong. However, there was what I consider a golden age where I looked at those people behind the chair, including herself and go, and I just said, that’s the bar, that’s what I need to get to. And so for her to take time as a friend and a mentor to push me and guide me to that school meant everything. And then to your point. Those instructors in school, they really, really were the force that pushed me even further. And so I’m grateful for them, and just that the connection they made and the time that they took to be compassionate and help someone who is learning fresh.

Chris Baran 9:24
Yeah, you know, it’s, you know, the what I love about doing this podcast as well, it’s, I mean, anybody that does podcasting will tell you that it’s you’re certainly doing it just because you love it because it certainly doesn’t pay. But what I love about it is that not only do I get to meet incredible people such as yourself, but I often find this link where there’s so much more in common than there is in differences with people in our industry. You know, and you mentioned that you’re you came from this golden era where you you looked up to and you saw these guiding lights in our industry and our industry was perceived in, in a different way at that time. And, you know, if you’re listening as opposed to watching me, you can tell by the incredible voice that I have that it probably sounds like I’m 30 years old. And I’m saying that with my tongue in my cheek, and I’m Canadian, that’s called sarcasm. But the reality is, is when I started in the industry, obviously I got it, I got into it in and hold on to your seats, ladies and gentlemen. 1967 was when I, and I don’t want to hear that you weren’t born yet. But when I when I started in the industry, it was still all rollers roller sets. And that’s when our industry had just started, just started to make that shift. You know, soons had come out, there was all that thing, but I was in Saskatchewan, that’s Humboldt, Saskatchewan, central Canada, you know, just jumped out of my igloo. And but the point is, is that that message hadn’t reached rural central Canada yet. And I got into it just because my mom was a hairdresser. But the reality was, I was just on the cusp, I was on the cusp and I, I saw the transition happening. And I went through that where it was, okay, fine. Putting rollers in I just got lost, I almost got fired from my job because you know, all of my monstrosities that it would build with back combing, oh, it would kind of fade over like a leaning collar when I when they were walking out. But the one of the owners of the building saw something in me and he said, this kid doesn’t know anything about cutting but he’s a good cutter. And so he moved me over to the other salon, where were one of the seer brothers Cy are one of they had he and limb did all the celebrities in town. And this is when when I had moved out of Humboldt to Saskatoon and then he, he saw the cutting talent in me and he so I got to cut all the hair, and he got to finish them. So the story is, though is I saw that area, and I came up in that era where you just you know, some of those cutters like I can remember when soons finally came to America, and I went to a class and I saw I just saw the instructors come in and and I was like oh in the sky, they would park and you know, you felt like you had to genuflect in front of them. And, and I I love that era. But I also love how Now those people that were the word there and the new people that are taking the place like yourself are not irreverent, and they are kind and they are willing to help. And they do. Just I there’s not I don’t think a person that’s out there that’s of your caliber that I couldn’t go up to, as a student said, hey, you know, what a thank you, can you help me for a second, and that person like yourself would stop and, and just give them whatever time they needed to help our industry along? So what what cultivated that in you like what made that? Because I know that I’m even going in my head going out of some of the orders of the things I want to talk to but, you know, I when I was on the beauty cast with you and the information and the advice you gave, and you spoke so kindly and so beautifully about it, what was it that shifted your brain?

Patrick Butler 13:17
Are you the excuse me, the owner of the school, his name was Lyle mikeg. And at the time, Lyle owned the school. But in addition to that what I didn’t realize and I came to realize later was he was heavily involved in the industry. And at that time, as you know, there were many shows throughout the country. We had a completely different system throughout the country with distributorship and individual shows city by city state by state. But he ran a team it was called the Yes Team and they are did big events, whether it was IBS or ABS or Premier. Yeah. And Lyle ran that team. Well, here’s me coming out of Omaha, Nebraska. And the reason I share that is, you know, people tend to overlook the middle of this country and say, Omaha, you didn’t come out of a big city. And at the time, people told me if you want to do something big in this industry, you better move, right, you better move to LA, New York, Chicago, whatever it may be. And I just couldn’t get my head around that. And I started to believe it for a moment. Until Lyle looked at me and said, Why did you Why do you think that’s what you need to do? And I said, Well, I want to, I’m really inspired by the things that you do and the team that you have on the stages at these big shows. And if that’s what I want to pursue, surely I must move and he said, Well, let’s not forget that I am still based here in Omaha, right and I’m doing those things. And suddenly, you know, Chris, that that just meant everything to me because once again, it bolstered me up and gave me the confidence I needed to go wait a minute, I can be anywhere and pursue this if I’ve got the right support and guidance that can help me understand how to get there. And so I think a couple of things to answer your original question. I think that those instructors along the way that continued to instill confidence in me and find ways to do so. And then here’s this owner, who’s running these teams at some of the biggest shows in the country, but still based in Omaha, Nebraska, and running a school, and taking time to help me with a haircut, or a color or a perm, on the beauty school floor, suddenly gave me that confidence and made me realize that you can go anywhere and do anything, if you really apply yourself and that really was the inspiration. But without those individuals without those instructors without Him and His guidance. I don’t know that I would have got there right away, that’s for sure. Yeah.

Chris Baran 15:41
Yeah. Because I see that and what I’m, we’re always around people that, you know, are on the way up or at closer to the top. And please understand for anybody listening and watching right now that when, when Patrick and I talk about people at the top, we’re only saying about our top, not you not of anybody else’s, because I think there’s a there’s a there’s a hill you have to climb in the industry, but there’s a human a bigger hill, you have to climb within yourself. And that comes with that confidence, you talked about etc. And I It reminds me of I had a young kid that worked for me and and this was we were in Victoria, British Columbia, Canada. And, and Jeff was this great kid that worked for us. And he said, I’m going to LA and I went, Oh, going to LA Okay, good. Sure. He says, Well, I’ve had a great offer there. And I said, so it sounds like he said, it sounds sounds like the grasses sounds a little bit greener there for you. And he said, Yeah, and by the way, I’m relating this story that I never knew I said, but he told me about this years later. And I will put in the adjective that I put into it. But I will say it without the expletive. But I said maybe you need to water your own lawn. And, and you know, and he said that stuck with him. And I hear that in the conversation that we’re having. Everybody always thinks that there’s somebody something out there, that will, it’s the location that’s going to help you. So everybody that’s watching and listening, just you know, listen to your heart, when it comes to stuff, everything that you have is within you. And it’s not necessarily going to be in the location, it’s always going to come from the people that are around you. And that’s what I heard you saying I

Patrick Butler 17:27
firmly believe that. And thankfully, I had that information given to me. And that advice given and drilled into me because that changed the game for me. And it allowed me to free my mind up and continue to absorb what was around me, and then focus that energy into doing the best I could write where I was at. Yeah. And in turn, that helped me get even further because then I could build my life behind the chair and then pursue things on the outside as well. And I’ll tell you without that boost and that belief and realizing that I could do that anywhere. I don’t think that I would have gotten there. I really don’t. And so I’m thankful and grateful for that advice.

Chris Baran 18:04
Yeah. And you don’t have to always people don’t have to come off as a know at all. It’s just the confidence that it gives you. That’s what I that’s what endeared me to you when I when we shared that time on beauty cast was that I went here. And when I think ego gets a bad tag, because I think everybody you have to have an ego and but an ego isn’t always bad. Ego just means here’s the person that I am right now that I need to be when I’m in this environment such as the stage, but you can still be yourself. And and that’s where I think so I wanted to just jump into this because I think that everybody that thinks of Naha that they think of well, you you have to have this upper self that you’re willing to put yourself on the line because it does take a big thicker skin to be able to say I’m gonna do some work and I’m gonna have all some of the people in the industry, check it out, and then grade you whether you’re going to be the winner or not so, but that all of that aside, tell me what that experience was like, because even I think it wasn’t in school. Your instructor got you to enter NAHA and you actually became up as one of the finalists. And I think that’s amazing. Tell us about that experience.

Patrick Butler 19:15
Yes, that was the owner Lyle again. And now ha was coming up and and building itself up in the industry. And he said, Hey, I know you want to continue to pursue things. Here’s an opportunity. I said, Well, what does it take? I have no idea. And he said, Well, it’s gonna take some photo work. Well, I looked at him, I said, Well, I’ve no clue where to start there. And he said, Well, that’s where I come in. And here’s the blessing in this whole conversation. He truly set it up. He said, here’s what we’re going to do. I’m going to share with you what I’ve come to know and learn over the years about photo work, but you’re gonna have to do the work. Yeah, you’re gonna have to be the one that does this. I’m just gonna facilitate. Thankfully, he set up the shoot but at that time, we had to produce five models and five does different distinct looks. And it was fantastic. Chris, it pushed me to my limits helped me understand a lot about makeup and just lighting and just getting into my first photo shoot. Well, lo and behold, we were really fortunate, we ended up making the finals and there were three finalists in each category. And thankfully, I made that and I ended up going to New Orleans. That’s where it was held that year. And you have to understand I was starstruck simply because at that time again, I’m dating myself, but at the time, I only read magazines, I read modern salon, American salon, those type of magazines. And that’s where I saw all these well known hairstylist barbers, hairdressers, doing this fantastic work, photo work stage work writing these articles that inspired me. And now here they were right in front of me in this Grand Ballroom in New Orleans. And I’ll tell you, I was starstruck but by the same token, and I’ve told this story before, I said, I need to get something out of this. I need to Yes, I want to win. Luckily, my my classmate, too, we made two of the three finals. My classmate won, it was fantastic. But here I was able to go up and talk to someone. I’ve told this story before, but I walked up to Irvine Rusk. And at the time, he really inspired me he did some great photo work he was he was building his shears out the mortars, his alpha, beta, gamma shears, and all that. And I walked up to him, and I introduced myself I said, Mr. Rusk, just want to take a moment to introduce myself and tell you who I am. My name is Patrick, and I’ve made the finals here. It’s just an honor to meet you. I’ve looked up to you and your work. I just really want to tell you how much it’s inspired me. By the way, do you have any advice for me as I begin my career, because I was just ready to get out and begin my career? And he said, Absolutely. He said, Congratulations on making it here. He said, Well, here’s my advice, take a look at the room. And I said, Yeah, for sure. It’s amazing. He said, Well, what do you see? And I said, Well, I see all these people who’ve inspired me, and they’re in the magazines, and they’re doing stage work. This is amazing. Who said, Well, I’ll tell you what you see. It’s a load of shit. And I said, Excuse me. And he said, My advice to you is to not get taken with that. And I said, Oh, okay. And he said, listen, here’s my advice to you. Do good work, do good. Work over and over again, fail at it, get better at it, and continue to do it over and over again until you master it. And if you need help, ask for it. But then get back in there and do it over and over again. That’s my advice. Yeah. When he shook my hand, turned and walked away, and that

Chris Baran 22:47
was typical. You know, and for those of you and that was the other part of the reason why I wanted to do this podcast is so people got to know our heritage, and Irvine Rusk, you know, and Irvine and Rita Rusk, and then urban, urban and Louise, they really helped to change our industry at the time, and I and they had a successful product line. But the reason why I’m saying this is you he was one of my hair heroes as well. And, and I have to say that it was really it’s really interesting, because and I don’t know if it was being a typical Scott, or it was the fact of just his nature, but he didn’t mince words, and and, and, and cussing was was part of the vernacular, and it was everyday stuff. So it was always out here. It was always colorful, it was always educational. And but it was always brutally honest. And that’s what I loved about that man. Is that he just told it like it is. So you know, is that’s where kind of it brought you to now, I want to just jump into because you right now, I mean, probably one of the hottest. Barber styling grooming companies is what you’re with, and especially being their creative and technical director. That takes a lot but before you got there. Tell us a little bit about when when How did you when you what was the hook that got you into education, number one, and then where did that lead you?

Patrick Butler 24:27
Well, after I got out of school

Chris Baran 24:30
while I got out.

Patrick Butler 24:33
After I did my time, my bid was up. I got out of school and as I did, American Crew had just launched in the industry. And so they had launched their initial product line. And then they started to do a tour of the country. And as I mentioned earlier, at that time distribution was far different. We have the two 800 pound gorillas in the industry now that distribute everything, but at the time every state had to a different distributor, and multiple ones that that. And so American Crew launched and started hitting the industry. Well, I had the opportunity to go attend one of their shows, and they came through town. And they did a stage show. And I remember sitting in the audience, I’ve watched onstage as there were multiple educators. But here’s the catch. There were barbers on stage, there were cosmetologist on stage. But the language that they spoke to the audience was a common language. There was no division, it was about hair cutting, who was about grooming, it was about how you interact with a client to recommend that product and why. And I couldn’t believe it. Because as I sat there, I realized one thing, Chris, I said, first of all, this is the first group that’s inspired me in that way. And I realized this, I need to pursue this, this is what I want to do. Because what I was really taken by was the fact that they washed away those titles and that division. And instead, they spoke to the group as one and said, This is how we can do it. This is how you can do this. And, you know, as you know, at that time in the industry, there was no one else speaking to the men’s market the way they did if they broke heavy ground at that time. Well, I was very fortunate, I pursued them. And I applied and I made it onto a regional team. And I started to learn the ins and outs of speaking to their product lines speaking to grooming skills and traits. And then learning how to just speak in general, learn how to educate to a group or an individual well, over time it grew, I was very fortunate to advance with that team. And I ended up making they’re at they called it the all star team, their international all star team has about a dozen of us. And we just started touring. And we did all the shows, spring and fall, we did every show across every state. And then later, American Crew opened an academy in Boulder, Colorado. And so it was interesting, because at the time as I continued to grow my skills, it was almost as if you had to choose, do you want to go into the academy work? Or do you want to do stage work? And some of my teammates at the time said, Well, you should stick with the stage work. I mean, this is where we have a ton of fun. And, you know, this is where you can really make an impact. And I said, well, actually like both. Is there anything preventing me from doing both? And the company said, No, absolutely not. We want you to do the stage work. And we want you to help with the academy. I dove into the academy, Chris. And what I really took away from that is something that sticks with me today. The power that you have to help someone grow their skill set in the moment that they can apply that day or the next day, if necessary, that can help them build their career. And I love that I love seeing the impact that we can have as educators to help someone grow. And again, it broke down division between barbers and cosmetologists. This was just about pure cutting, hair, grooming, and helping you. That’s how it started. And I was very fortunate to stay with them for 10 years. And in that time period, they allowed me to travel the world and teach in multiple countries and open more more academies, and do a ton of stage work. And in the process, what that did for me, was it helped me develop my skill set, build my confidence. And in turn, I could push that back and bring it forward for others. And I’m so grateful that opportunity changed my career.

Chris Baran 28:34
Yeah, i i We are more akin than different. And I’ve said that before. You said something in there that I just loved and that and and I want to equate it to a thing that most people say because I heard it when you say when you teach somebody something and you always hear this one, the light bulb went off in their in their head. And I want to take that a little deeper because I think that the more we talk about the light bulb, the more they think it’s a magical moment where you you turn the switch and you do it turn the switch but the light bulbs called understand and I think that that when you can take someone who goes from memorization to truly understanding that’s the difference. And that’s the difference between education and I’m not gonna say inspiration and maybe maybe that is right because there’s a lot of work that’s out there that inspires me my a lot of people that I was inspired by. Were are like Trevor and Ervin and Anthony Mascolo and the like all that like, you know, from the avant garde work, it was like Robert le betta, and so on that they truly inspired me, but I never had any they didn’t really teach me they inspired me because they weren’t around me. But Patrick when you when I see it when and I even know it When talking to you that when you when you’re teaching someone in the academy or on stage, it’s about how do you take somebody that was and transform them from where they were before when they were memorizing stuff where they can actually understand it and apply it to everywhere else. What What was it that that was that, again, I’m going to use the light switch or whatever, what, what was the thing that helped you to turn that around so that you could actually transform those people?

Patrick Butler 30:30
I think it’s a couple pieces of advice that were given to me, because I do not believe that I have this amazing, God given talent that led me to this place right here. I do not believe that I don’t get me wrong, I truly admire those individuals who have that creative spark that truly comes out and can elevate their game. Fantastic. That’s wonderful, I think for the majority of us. So we have to learn these skills and understand how to hone our craft. And the advice that helped me get there came from one of my mentors along the way, especially at American Crew, because I just, I had that self doubt, right. And I don’t know if I belong here, it was the imposter syndrome. And they said, Listen, you know, the quote they gave me was, you know, knowing how to do something makes you capable. I said, Sure. And they said, knowing why you do something makes you a professional. And that why is where we need to focus and hone our energy. Because if you can transfer the why to someone else, and help them understand the why behind their action, you’re truly going to open them up. And I said, Well, again, I don’t know if I have that talent. And they said, listen, as an educator, bringing out the best in others is a skill that just takes about 10% natural inclination, the other 90% has to be deliberate. And that helped me so much, because suddenly it gave me the confidence to again, push forward. Because I knew when they said that, that my deliberate actions, learning that skill, honing that craft being very deliberate in my action, so I can master it, and then push it forward and transfer that to someone else. I knew I could help someone in that moment. And so those two pieces of advice helped me tremendously, because then it empowered me to again, focus on my craft, master it, and then transfer that to others. And I truly feel indebted to those individuals who took the time to help me understand that. And I feel it’s inherent upon myself right now, as I continue in my career, to push that forward to others. Because I don’t feel like I had that natural ability that just was going to help me glide through life and glide through the industry. With ease, I had to work hard and I had to hone those skills. And now I feel like I want to help others understand that they have that capability as well. And that’s what’s propelled me forward every step of the way. Yeah,

Chris Baran 33:02
I keep listening to you and say, We can be friends. Friends, because you’re saying I’m going to I’m sure people listening are going yeah, you know, I, I I want to jump back to what you were saying just about the natural ability. I mean, I think everybody I don’t think anybody’s people might get hate mail for this one. I don’t think anybody is born with an ability. You but because I mean, let’s face it, we all know Michael Phelps, Michael Phelps might have somewhere along the line said you know what, why don’t I jump in the pool. But he didn’t wasn’t an Olympian because he just jumped in the pool and became an A, he had to train. He had to push himself he had to go through hardships, he had to he had to give up on other things so that he could be master of some thing. And and I see that’s what happens in our industry. So what I really want people that are listening, and watching to get is that, you know, whatever we do, you can do to its mirror, I always say Mary Mary Behrens boy Chris, if he can do it, God helped me anybody can do it. It all it does is just like I always say, and I’ve said it 1000 times, fail your way to the top. Don’t be afraid of failure. Just keep cooking. up but I love what you said about knowing knowing makes you capable understanding makes you a professional because that means give me a little more about what that means to you because I got my take on it. But what does that when he says, you know, makes you a professional? And I think there’s a couple of things that I words that get bandied around in our industry. And it’s it’s professionalism. And I don’t not that I don’t believe in the word I do. But it certainly is requires qualifying what when you say knowing makes you capable. But understanding makes you professional. Give us a little more on that.

Patrick Butler 35:00
Well, it’s interesting when we teach classes, and I’ve had that opportunity where I’ve been working with people, and they said, Gosh, this is great. These are great skills to focus on, hey, can you help me understand how to do this trend? Okay. That’s great. Show me the photograph, show me what you’re inspired by right now. And, and they said, Well, how do you do that? I want to learn how to do that. And I, I think I frustrate them. Because I come back and said, well, then we need to focus on exactly what we’re doing right now. We need to master our skills, the foundational skills that you need to understand. Because if you understand cause and effect, you can understand how to adapt to anything that comes down the line, anyone who sits in your chair. And it’s funny, because it takes people a moment to understand where at where I’m going with that sometimes. But the truth is, I fully believe that knowing the why the cause and effect if I do this, this will occur. How do I adapt that to the situation now, and I love that I love when we can break through in those moments. Because now I know you can take it to the next level. And that’s what I mean by professionalism. Because, in turn, what I I’ve always encouraged people to do is you need to share your knowledge, not just with other fellow hairdressers and barbers, you need to share your knowledge with your clientele as well. Because the more that they can see that you are mastering your craft and understanding why you’re choosing to do something, the more confidence they have in your ability. Yeah, and they believe in you, and they’re gonna want to come back more and more.

Chris Baran 36:33
Yeah, I love that. And I, it just made this click in my head when you were talking there that we’ve moved, I’ve watched our industry and I’m not saying all of them do have done it, but we went from kind of departmentalization and even some of the bigger salons that we have, especially after COVID and so on, they started to go through the eight, D departmentalized. And went to a you know, where everybody did everything. And I think that at least my opinion, not that it’s it’s bad. Just that it it got us stuck where people before that weren’t afraid of short hair, they weren’t afraid of cutting hair, somebody came in and and talked about having a haircut or saying I want an appointment cuz I want to take all my hair off, people would scatter. And people like you and I would go Put me in coach, I want to be there because to me is and I’ve always said this and this is something I really truly believe in long hair or short hair does not make you beautiful, that you every person is beautiful. And it’s how your inside deals with your outside that makes you more or less beautiful. And a part of it is the confidence and what I love to me when I see a woman that has the confidence to you know, say cut their hair short be their own self and to me that’s that’s true beauty. But I think that right now where our industry is going to shift, because let’s face it, we’re at the tipping point. Long hair has been going on for so long. Coloring long hair has been going on for so long and is there’s there’s about to be a huge shift in our industry. This episode is sponsored by the salon associate accelerator from trainers playbook.com. Are you struggling with the time and cost of associate training? Do you feel like your salon is running you will get your associates on the floor, all with 90% Less time from you. So you can get back to building your business. Get them world class design, finishing color and client care skills they’ll use every day for the rest of their career. While you focus on realizing your vision. Go to trainers playbook.com and get the salon associate accelerator. And now back to the show. What do you say to people? Or how did like what do you think is going to take our industry to from that tipping? What do you think’s going to happen in that when that tipping point happens? All of a sudden the clients everybody starts coming in and wanting their hair shorter? I

Patrick Butler 39:18
think there’s a couple of things. I mean, we’ve talked about trends and how they come and go. But I think as you said something that really stuck with me it’s helping someone understand that they are capable of pulling this off and looking this way and that inner beauty is going to shine even more as we help enhance that from the outside. And I really feel it’s I’ve always felt this way that it’s our responsibility behind the chair to help someone see what they can’t see in themselves sometimes, and we can’t solve it all you know we well the joke is always about us being psychiatrists just as much as we do hair. But the truth is, I think there are some simple ways that we can instill that kind offense and others and help bring that out into your to answer your question. I think the tipping point, quite honestly, is how we take it upon ourselves behind the chair, regardless of your title, to put ourselves in that moment with that client, and really help bring that out of them and show them the capability and opportunity that they have to enhance their look. And I know that sounds like a very broad answer, and it may not seem to be getting very specific. But if I dig under there a little bit more, what I’m saying is, I continue to see a lack of connection. And it’s a missing skill in our industries, where it’s that interpersonal interaction and developing the connection. And I’ll tell you real quickly, we did a study on it, we hired an outside group to do a study on this. And the industry, not just us, but the industry average of first time clients who come back for a second visit is only at 30%. Wow, 30% of your clients are coming back after the first visit. Well, here’s where the information really hit home, that we hired the company to figure out why. So they called these people up, they connected with them, and they said, Hey, what happened? Did you have a great experience? Yes, fine. Was someone rude to you? No. Oh, well, why aren’t you coming back for that second visit, I just didn’t feel like I had a connection with that stylus or barber, I don’t know that they truly saw what I wanted. So I’m gonna try someone else. And so the mindset was, I’m going to shop until I find someone because I don’t feel like connected. And suddenly, I bring that up, because suddenly that really brought to the surface, the fact that we all depend on that connection, we want to relate to someone, we want to connect with someone. And we want their confidence to shine so we can feel great about what they’re trying to recommend to us. And I think that’s the tipping point, in my opinion, is how we can all start to work together to bring that out to make the connection, because then it just opens up the opportunity for all of us.

Chris Baran 42:02
Yeah, yeah, I think that it’s sitting right there. And this is going to set I’m going to try to get this question out in a quasi intelligent manner. But what I love, I heard what you say is shopping. And I think now like when you and I started out in the industry, there was no internet. So people often came back just because there was no billboard anywhere, I’m telling you anywhere else. And it was like a shot in the dark. Everybody sees everybody’s social right now and what they work they can do. It doesn’t mean they’re going to get any better service or find a connection, but they will they know people that they can try out, try out, same as they did with us if we’re the ones that let them go. But what I what I find right now is they have that availability, our customers are moving around more have the at least have the availability to move around more. But the reality is, is how do we get them to stick? And I think that’s part of what you were talking what would what advice would you give to people to make them stick? How do you? How do you really make them stick and say I want to be with you and et cetera. I

Patrick Butler 43:08
say this a lot to a lot of our younger team members. And I said, Listen, with your actions behind the chair. Okay, I want you to go with me on this. And I tell them all the time. 100% is easy. 90% is hard. And they stare at me. Like, what do you mean by that? And I said, if you are consistent with how you interact with your client, how you guide them, how you recommend products, how you recommend change how you whatever you’re doing, if you’re 100% and deliberate with your actions over and over again. It’s easy, because you’ve mastered that you’ve made that your own and you’re intentional with your questioning and your actions. 90% is hard. And they’re like, Well, 90% is close to 100. I said Yeah, but it’s not 100%. And here’s why 90% means you’re picking and choosing what you think you’re going to share with that client. And suddenly, you’re holding back what you’ve been offered them, and you’re not as deliberate in your actions you think you can cherry pick your way through. The most successful people behind the chair that I’ve ever seen, are 100% with their actions, and they’re deliberate with how they speak to their clients and what they offer and the confidence that they show when they do so. And I tell people all the time, if you’re going to make this change, if you’re going to be successful, I highly recommend putting 100%. And because this can be far easier than giving 9% and picking and choosing when you put it on with that client. Yeah. And suddenly it starts to flip for them and they go okay, I’m like, let’s take one thing at a time though. Okay, what are you going to do 100% of the time and then pick up from there and build on that. And that’s helped me it’s helped others quite a bit. But I really think that that’s the first step a lot of people need to understand is how do I commit 100% to this? Yeah, Some, sometimes we think we are but we’re not. Yeah. And 100%

Chris Baran 45:03
might mean, in my in my thinking is that if I’m not 100% at it, where do I need to go to get my education? That takes me to that 100%? Or takes me at least my skill? Because I think you’re talking about a couple of things. You’re talking about the soft sale, the soft goods that it takes just to, to help to talk, convince, consult with someone, but then you have to have the hard skills to match. And could you speak to us a little bit about that with like, what, how would you advise somebody of their hard skills aren’t quite there. And let me I want to be even more specific. Right, now, let’s just talk about that I know that I look at I can do Bali as like, like, a king and a queen. I can cut length and layers in the hair. I can handle curling irons, blow dryers and all of that. But in deep down, it’s not that I don’t like cutting short hair. I’m terrified because I don’t know how to cut short hair. So what would you say to that person that could help them push them over the line that they need to learn?

Patrick Butler 46:16
Absolutely, I, you know, I, why focus a lot on short hair. And obviously our business I work in at Floyds. We focus on that. It’s a huge part of our business. But I’ll tell you, if I go back in my career, and look, I didn’t start there. As matter of fact, I was inspired by a company that focused on it. And I wanted to pursue them. And in the back of my mind, I go, Oh, my gosh, what am I getting into? I don’t have these skills. I didn’t develop these skills in school. It didn’t stop me and I had to start somewhere. And what I’d recommend to anybody is this. It’s going to start with that that first step is the key here. And the good news for all of us here is yes, you can have access to education anywhere, by by means of holding that phone in your hand or the iPad or computer that you use and watching any videos. But that practical work is invaluable. And so I’ve had people say, Well, where do I begin? I said, Well, you begin in a very simple place. I go Who Who do you know that you can start with right? And I said, let’s start slow, quit looking at videos that are jumping all the way to the top of the mountain in one fell swoop, I go you you instantly want to do a skin fade because you saw a video, when you should be focusing on a low taper and understanding the impact of what that clipper can do. within an inch of the neckline. If I can start you out there and build confidence and lower taper work and fading work. You can move your way up to a mid fade to a high fade and suddenly you’ll advance yourself to a skin fade. But don’t try to do postgraduate work before you graduated from high school. Yeah.

Chris Baran 48:00
Yeah, no, I, I loved and I want to bring up something right now. Because I’ve heard you talk before about, you know, a learning curve and a forgetting curve. Give us a little bit more about what do you mean by that?

Patrick Butler 48:16
Oh, my goodness, this, this made a big impact on me. As an educator, I feel this responsibility to give everything to the class or individuals that I’m working with. And suddenly, I want to just pour out all my knowledge and I don’t want to I feel a responsibility to give you everything I can. What I didn’t understand as an educator was, there’s only so much that person can absorb and take away. And if I teach a one hour class two hour class or three hour class, I’m pouring more into that moment, and expecting them to retain all that. The truth is what I learned about education, and in anyone taking a class, including ourselves is we only have the ability to absorb and walk away from the classroom with so much information. And quite frankly, it’s only about 20% of what we sat through. And so when I think about the forgetting curve, it means the second I walk out of the door of a class, I’m losing information, it’s falling out of my head, literally. It’s falling away. And I could have takeaways, pamphlets, papers, notes that I’ve made. And they can help me to a certain extent, depending on how much I apply it. But the truth is, I’m only walking away with about 20% of what you’ve shared with me. Or if I’m an educator, how can I flip the script and go what is the most important thing that I need to share with this person right now? Knowing that that’s what they need to walk away with. And that ability to edit the information helped me as an educator get more focused on what I need to deliver. As an attendee, if I’m taking a class, I always challenge everyone. What is the one thing that you’re going to take away from this class and be able to apply today or two Morell, because you cannot get further than that. Yeah, if you do, you’ll forget. And you’ll lose the confidence to do so. And so the forgetting curve is impactful to me in two different ways I think about as an educator, what my responsibility is to be focused, as an attendee, what do I need to do to focus on one thing? Let’s make it simple here. What can I do to improve today? And it starts with one thing, and that’s really, really been helpful to me. Yeah,

Chris Baran 50:26
I love what you said there. Because, again, you’re making light bulbs go off in my head. Because I keep thinking about the times when I went to education. And I watched people do something. And I said, that’s really cool. But I didn’t do it within 24 hours. And then I, you know, then what, a couple of things happen to me. Number one is I lost confidence and do it, like you said, but it affected the way that I would go to other classes, because I’d say, Well, I went something there. And I would blame them saying, well, they, they taught it, but I can’t do it. But the reality is, is the only way that you get from from to success and learning something is by actually doing it yourself within that 24 hour period. And that’s why I think that they’re while I, I look at at at Instagram and tick tock and I’m always looking for ideas for inspiration. But if I can’t, if I can’t get that, instead of that one minute video, I think I was listening to something that you did with our other good friend, Gordon Miller, and he was saying, I love this. And he said, listen, would you go to a class that was only and pay money to go to a class that was only one minute long? And, and not have a chance to ask any questions, etc. That’s the difference between the the stuff that we that we do, when you go to a class, when you’re truly learning, you be invested in it, you’re actually doing it, you have your hands in there, down and dirty. And you’ve got to remember, you’re probably only get it going to get it to 60% of success. But that’s what you have to do. Anytime if you can get to 60% of success on the first go round. You’re golden, because then you’ll master it.

Patrick Butler 52:15
Absolutely. I love that. And Gordon is exactly right. You and I wouldn’t pay for that. I mean, you know that conversation was interesting, because you and I, I know this to be true. You and I have watched many videos and early on the instructional videos that we had access to. We’re talking about videos that were 35 4050 an hour long, where we saw every step of a haircut every step of a color process mistakes and only absorb it. We took it all, we loved it. And now there’s the challenge to go well, how can I deliver that in 30 seconds?

Chris Baran 52:53
Yeah, so yeah, that that swipe left swipe, wrap, a metallic mark? mentality really does. I think it robs our education right now. And again, don’t get me wrong for people I’m not I’m not Pooh poohing it. I use it, Patrick, I know you do. It’s there for inspiration to help to push you or solve a quick problem. When there’s other people that are out there that do a one minute video of just one little technique. So you get in the technique. You don’t watch it all the way through. But I understand what overcorrection is, I understand what elevation is and so on. Those are what I still think are amazing. Like I you know, we have mutual friends like with Matt Sweeney. And that’s what I love with he and DJ and Muldoon and those people do is they’ll give you one technique and just show you that one little principle that that makes you better, you still got to go out and do it in altering. And that’s why I think that there there is going to be a huge movement back to I think Gordon calls it long education, you know, where you have to sit in an environment and get something back from it. You’re you want to be invested, you’re gonna make a mistake, people are gonna help to correct. And that’s the way you get better at what you do. And I’m really looking forward to that. And our industry.

Patrick Butler 54:09
Couldn’t agree more. Yeah, I couldn’t agree more. So

Chris Baran 54:11
we’ve talked a lot about that. And I and but we talked about that I want to talk to just for a second about Floyd’s and I because that, to me, I think they’re one of the bigger movers and shakers that there are in our industry right now. Tell me what that’s like, when would give me a little bit of vibe of the culture?

Patrick Butler 54:32
Well, Florida’s interesting because they’ve been in the industry for 23 years, and we’ve been able to grow quickly in that time period, where we’ve kind of expanded our footprint across the US. But in doing so, it’s been interesting to watch because as I tell people where who I’m involved with and the work that I do, excuse me, the first thing that they say usually in response if they haven’t heard of Floyd’s is O Floyd’s is a barber shop. And I said, Well Oh, you’re right. It’s on our signage, it’s on our door. But once you walk inside that door, I think you’re going to be very surprised at what you see and experience. And here’s why. Our locations definitely do not look like a traditional barbershop and or salon. We’ve always had a really heavy music influence. And so we’ve got these giant poster walls with all these artists on it. And we deliberately play a variety of music very loudly, just to have fun, and it changes genres. But when you dig a little deeper, let’s get to the heart of what we do that’s most important here. We’re not just a barber shop. As a matter of fact, we employ far more cosmetologist than we do barbers. We’ve got 70% barbers versus 3070 70%, cosmetologist versus 30%. Barbers, it’s just the way the industry is kind of stacked in numbers wise. But our range of services is what catches people off guard, we’ve got a full color bar on the back bar waxing services as well, we’ve got a range of take home on the front end. In other words, we can serve as anyone male, female child, that doesn’t matter. And so really, when you look at it, and back out of the picture, you go, Wait a minute, that’s not just a barbershop, it’s a hybrid. It’s a hybrid of what a barbershop and Salon should be in could be today now. And we feel that it’s been very relevant to the changing, you know, climate in our industry, as well as our society where people are looking for something a little bit different. And in doing so, they’re finding that, hey, this dislocation can really help me bring out what I want to but do in a different way. Yeah. And so we have a lot of fun, we really focus on inclusivity. With our staff. We don’t have, it’s funny, we don’t have a strict dress code in the sense that we’re not telling you, you have to wear all black or all white. We want people to feel the best version of themselves, because we feel that if they do, they’re going to do the best work possible. So they really get into the fashion they wear, the hair that they have the tattoos that they have, it doesn’t matter. We focus on letting them be themselves so they can do their best work. And in turn, our clients love that. And so we’ve had great success with that. And it’s just a really fun environment that we’ve adapted to the different cities and markets we’re in. And in doing so we’ve kind of taken a neighborhood barbershop feel, and elevated that in turn, it’s really helped us grow quickly. Yeah,

Chris Baran 57:28
because, you know, I think everybody’s seen it in our industry is how, how the barber shop, went, Yeah, I’m gonna take you back, like into the 70s barbering actually took a bit of a dive because that hairdressers were not when unisex as was called at the time. And for those of you listening, I’m actually using air quotes there, that they they went unisex and robbed a lot of it. But then kind of we lost that barbering skill. And then when barbering came back to the barbers, I’ll tell you, when I was watching, I’m going to add, if I would have started, then I want to go, I want to be a barber, because they, they have way more fun doing short hair than than the hairstylist did. So that was a huge shift that will happen. And I, to me, as is I just went, it was so much fun, because it was so exciting, and so extreme and what they would do. So I think that really helped us along. So I want to just, you know, I want to just what, Patrick, what pushes you what pushes you as that as, you know, as a human being as a hairdresser, as somebody who wants to advance in their career? Because the reason why I’m asking that is, is so that is that people that are young kids that are listening that out there right now is to, for them to understand that it is possible. It is possible that you can get anything you want. That

Patrick Butler 58:46
it is true. And I’ll tell you, if I stop right now and answer that question, the first thing that have to say is that I could not be more grateful for what this industry has done to my life. But I will also in the same breath tell you that it wouldn’t have been possible without the mentorship and coaching that I received along the way. And I can’t encourage anyone enough to seek out mentorship and coaching because it’s going to come in different forms. It’s going to come at different stages of your life, different stages of your career, and it may come from unsuspecting places. But if you lean into that it’s going to allow you the opportunity to grow. And I’ll tell you, I am a case study in someone who didn’t believe that they had that natural ability that came from the middle of the country, a smaller city and has been able to experience so much in this industry. And it wasn’t because it was handed to me. It wasn’t because I had this innate ability to just turn it on and shine. I put in a lot of hard work but by the same token, that hard work allowed me to pursue other opportunities whether it was an education doing stage work photo or video work, being able to write articles, it doesn’t matter. All of that built on itself. But it wouldn’t have been possible without that mentorship, because truthfully, and I’ve said this before in other conversations, I started out my career, and I didn’t have that immediately, I almost failed. I almost got out of this industry. The very first year, I would have been classified as failing. And my good friend who got me in the industry, sat me down, set me straight, and said, You better start asking questions and seeking guidance from everyone around you because they’re doing it, aren’t they? And I said, Yes. And she said, Start asking questions now and adapting and figuring out how to make one thing your own at a time. Yeah, and in doing so that helped me master that skill and grow. And I would tell anybody, now, you can do this. And I’ll tell you why. Again, I’m gonna go back to what my success, my success was born out of a lot of hard work, and also born out of me seeking out guidance from others around me, but then not shutting down and opening myself up and allowing myself to take in what the advice they gave me. Because I’ll tell you that one thing that I see people do that really, really deflates me is when they shut down and think that they know, everything they need to know right now. And it doesn’t matter. At any stage of your career, you can absorb more, and you can grow. And so I’m just so thankful, Chris, for the opportunities I’ve had, because without them and without that mentorship, I wouldn’t be where I’m at. And I still have room to grow. Yeah. And to answer your first question. I still have a lot of room to grow. And I can’t wait to get there. Yeah.

Chris Baran 1:01:39
Yeah. The I remember a line that Trevor Sorbie once said, he said, I’m I’m more interested in what I don’t know. And what I do know. And I thought there in lies the rub.

Patrick Butler 1:01:55
Absolutely. He is so good. Yeah. Good.

Chris Baran 1:01:59
Okay, we’ve hit the time where I want to go rapid fire, just erase things that come to your brain, you know, one word, one quick sentence. What turns you on in the crowd in the creative process?

Patrick Butler 1:02:14
What turns me on the creative process, just been able to see that I can push beyond ice,

Chris Baran 1:02:20
what stifles the creative process for you.

Patrick Butler 1:02:25
When I stopped opening up, I literally have and I know this is more than one word answer. And I’ll be quick about it. But when I find myself getting into a plateau or rut, and I just put it on cruise control, that’s what stifles me. And I have to shake myself love

Chris Baran 1:02:40
it. The thing in a life that you dislike the most.

Patrick Butler 1:02:46
Just like the most. I’m in a lot of meetings, Chris. I’m in a lot of meetings as behind the scenes, but I’m a creative and I want to keep moving. Yeah.

Chris Baran 1:02:58
Well, I think you answered it right there. What do you love the most in life? Creating? There you go. What was the most difficult time in your life?

Patrick Butler 1:03:10
Most difficult time was, was when I thought I failed. Initially in this industry, I put all my eggs in one basket, and I thought I failed. And until I had that guidance to get me out, I literally hit the one of the lowest points I’ve ever had.

Chris Baran 1:03:24
Wow. And thank God, you’ve got to the other side. The the things that you think that you dislike most about our industry?

Patrick Butler 1:03:41
Well, I’m gonna just go straight forward on this one. The thing that I dislike about our industry right now is it’s exciting that we’ve used technology to advance and expose different parts of our industry. But by the same token, I don’t like that we have limited the opportunity for a lot of interaction from classwork. And I just think it’s a missing element that unfortunately a lot of hairdressers and barbers really could benefit from Yeah.

Chris Baran 1:04:09
And what do you like most about our industry?

Patrick Butler 1:04:13
Oh, that is limitless. I just, we continue to reinvent ourselves and to build on the foundations that have been laid for us and we cannot be stopped. It is fantastic. Proudest

Chris Baran 1:04:27
moment of your life. My children live in person that you admire the most

Patrick Butler 1:04:35
loving person that I admire the most my sister

Chris Baran 1:04:38
person that you wish you could meet living or dead.

Patrick Butler 1:04:43
Oh goodness. I would love to sit down with Mick Jagger. Oh,

Chris Baran 1:04:49
yeah, you got a few years left on that one. The month off, where would you go? What would you do?

Patrick Butler 1:05:00
month off where I’d go, I would probably had some more warmer. I’m in a colder climate. So I would take a January and I would head to a warmer climate and just let it go.

Chris Baran 1:05:14
I love it. Something that people don’t know about you.

Patrick Butler 1:05:20
I’m a huge auto racing fan. Oh, wow. And huge, huge, huge. And so people never get that one. They’re like, Oh, here’s the hair guy who’s in car racing. What? Just a huge fan.

Chris Baran 1:05:33
Your greatest fear.

Patrick Butler 1:05:35
My greatest fear. Honestly, not being able to see my children grow and see the heights that they’re gonna reach. I want to be able to see that

Chris Baran 1:05:47
beautiful, favorite curse word. Fuck, favorite comfort food?

Patrick Butler 1:05:56
Burger and Fries.

Chris Baran 1:05:58
If you could change one thing about yourself, what would you do? What would it be?

Patrick Butler 1:06:03
Oh, goodness, I would slow myself down.

Chris Baran 1:06:07
Your most treasured possession.

Patrick Butler 1:06:14
My most treasured possession is the teddy bear that I received before I was one year old. And I still got it to this day awesome.

Chris Baran 1:06:25
Something in the industry that you haven’t done, but you’d want to?

Patrick Butler 1:06:31
Oh, gosh, I’m in such great admiration of the people who are doing this work right now with extensions and hair webs. I think they’re doing tremendous work. And it’s changed things. I wish I knew more about it. I’ve studied some of it and got my hands in. But I would like to get more into that a little bit.

Chris Baran 1:06:49
Now I won’t I’ll tell you, I’m gonna ask you what if you could have a do over? What would it be? But I won’t? I’m not going to take that I wouldn’t change anything because I wouldn’t be who I am today? If but if you could change one thing, just one thing, what would it be?

Patrick Butler 1:07:03
Oh, I would have gotten into this industry far sooner.

Chris Baran 1:07:07
Tomorrow, you couldn’t do hair couldn’t be involved with it at all? What would it be? What would you do?

Patrick Butler 1:07:15
teacher educator love it. I’d go into a classroom.

Chris Baran 1:07:18
And then if you had one wish for industry, what would it be?

Patrick Butler 1:07:25
My one wish for our industry would be to continue to break through. I mean, we’ve we’ve unfortunately, we create a lot division. And it only in the sense that we’ve pushed a lot of people out onto their own without a lot of guidance and mentorship. I wish we could rein some of that in.

Chris Baran 1:07:45
Love it. Patrick, first of all, if people want to get in touch with you want to know more from you, how can they what can they do? What would how would they get a hold of you?

Patrick Butler 1:07:59
One of the easiest ways is to use Instagram and just DM me it’s P B educator as the fastest way love PB educator.

Chris Baran 1:08:11
My friend like I said, I’m calling you friend because that’s what I really value as right now not only as a fellow human being but we have so much kinship in where our backgrounds came from and what we do. I really feel a real close connection even though we haven’t had that. And I want to have that happen where we can meet one another give each other a hug have a beer and sit down talk more like this. So I can’t thank you enough for being on the program and giving up your time.

Patrick Butler 1:08:39
Well, first of all, we are going to make that happen and I look forward to that time. And Chris, I can’t thank you enough for someone I’ve looked up to for a long time and just having this conversation means everything. Thank you.

Chris Baran 1:08:51
Pleasure. Cheers, my friend. Cheers to you.